Debt Ceiling Battle Looms
These days, Congress rarely does much of anything without a deadline staring them in the face. The only substantive piece of legislation Congress has so far put on President Trump's desk (four months into his term) has been a continuing resolution to fund the government through the end of the fiscal year. Not exactly a spectacular record of achievement for the GOP to be proud of, but then that's pretty much par for the course for the Republican Congress these days. What will quite likely be the second major piece of legislation that gets passed, at this rate, will be raising the debt ceiling.
Of course, it wasn't supposed to be this way. In Paul Ryan's dream scenario, Republicans were supposed to line up several items on their wish list, crank them out, and put them on Trump's desk to sign. So far, that hasn't happened. The health care bill limped out of the House, but nothing else has yet been achieved. Even their revised schedule now looks rather dubious, as Senate action on health care and a grand overhaul of the tax code keep getting pushed further and further back. None of this Republican agenda really has a built-in deadline, however, so things can be endlessly punted with no real consequence (other than political fallout).
There are two big battles looming, though, that do have a hard deadline. The federal fiscal year ends in September, meaning next year's budget is theoretically supposed to be in place by the first of October. Trump was months late with his budget proposal, and so far neither house of Congress has produced much of anything in the way of budget bills. This means the fight will consume all of September, and the end result may be nothing more than yet another omnibus bill or continuing resolution.
The second big battle was originally supposed to happen after the budget fight, but has now been moved up. Due to weaker-than-expected federal revenues coming in, the debt ceiling will probably be hit months earlier than predicted. Officially, we've already hit the debt ceiling, but there is always a certain amount of leeway with the federal budget -- funds can be shifted around to paper things over for a few months. This is what is already happening, but the initial estimates were that this period of accounting trickery would last until almost the end of the year. With weaker revenues, though, the number crunchers are now warning Congress that we could hit the debt ceiling this summer. Since Congress takes the entire month of August off, what this means is that the debt ceiling now has to be raised before they all scarper off for their annual extended vacation. And August is only two months away.
Before the Tea Party phenomenon, raising the debt ceiling was a pretty low-key affair in Congress. A certain amount of political grandstanding would happen, but then there'd be a bipartisan vote and Congress would quickly move on to other pressing issues. Nowadays, though, the debt ceiling is an all-out ideological fight. Hardline Republicans see raising the debt ceiling as leverage to cut federal spending, even though this has never really worked the way they want it to. Being in control of both houses of Congress is likely to embolden the hardliners once again, which sets the scene for a bruising battle some time in the next two months.
Failing to raise the debt ceiling would have catastrophic consequences to the American economy. This is the "hostage" that the hardliners will attempt to use, once again, in an effort to further their own budgetary agenda. But there are enough sane Republicans left (who know that the consequences would indeed be catastrophic) to get a debt ceiling bill passed. Their problem, however, is that they're going to need Democrats to get on board in order to have enough votes to do so.
The hardliner Tea Party faction essentially puts the Democrats in the driver's seat. This has been evident for quite some time in the House, and this time around should be no different. The continuing resolution on the budget that passed earlier this year is a case in point. Democrats got most of what they wanted out of the bill, and Republicans got very little of what they wanted. All the "poison pill" ideas from the GOP were stripped out of the final bill, in other words. The debt ceiling legislation will probably take a similar course.
The Tea Party extremists will try to load the bill up with all kinds of Draconian amendments. These will have zero chance of passing the Senate, though, where Democrats still have the ability to filibuster. Democrats will make a counteroffer, which will quite likely contain some major Democratic priorities. Some of these may be a bridge too far for even moderate Republicans, who will label them poison pills and push back. But the closer we get to the deadline (in this case, probably "when the August vacation is scheduled to begin"), the more willing moderate Republicans will be to cut a deal. The White House will likely take a hands-off approach, as they did with the continuing resolution. So what we'll all get is a few weeks of sound and fury from the Tea Partiers, followed by a deal being struck between Democrats and the Republican leadership. This will pass just before the break begins, and Trump will sign it.
Of course, I could easily be wrong about all of that. Predicting Washington behavior these days is a dicey business, after all. Anything could happen, in other words. Congress could leave town without acting, which could even lead to a special session interrupting their monthlong break, to deal with the problem before disaster hits. Trump could take it into his head to veto whatever Congress passes. Or the fight in Congress may be so intense that nothing passes at all. Predicting the probability of any of these things happening is tough to do, these days.
I remain cautiously optimistic, though. I think the debt ceiling fight will be resolved pretty close to how the continuing resolution fight was resolved. Democrats will score some major victories, Republicans will score a few of their own, but all the poison pills from both sides will get left by the wayside (only to return once again in the September budget battle to come). The only difference will be that the debt ceiling fight will happen sooner than expected. This will have one beneficial side effect, as well -- the upcoming debt ceiling fight will likely suck all the political oxygen from Congress to such an extent that their schedules for things like healthcare and tax reform will have to be further extended. Paul Ryan's dreams of shredding the safety net will quite likely have to wait, in other words. And that's something to really be optimistic about, at least from where I sit.
-- Chris Weigant
Follow Chris on Twitter: @ChrisWeigant
So the situation is:
Scenario 1: Tea Party throw a wobbly, Ryan needs Democrats, Democrats demand a few goodies and no crazy pants stuff from the loons - 45 signs off, everybody goes to Italy for a couple of weeks
Scenario 2: Tea Party decides to sit this one out for he most part. Republicans get to jam some of their goodies in, just enough not to force a filibuster - 45 signs off, everybody goes to Italy for a couple of weeks
Scenario 3: Tea Party throws a wobbly, 45 starts throwing his own wobbly, it comes to a game of chicken with the bond market, the bond market reminds 45 and the Tea Party who really owns and runs the country.
I can't think of any more scenarios - my best guess is #1, but there are enough loons in Congress and definitely in the White House not to rule out #3.
I saw this over on Political Orphans and liked it:
The Five Stages of Trumpism:
(1) It’s a total lie, never happened, is fake news.
(2) It happened but it’s not a big deal.
(3) OK, it might be a big deal but it’s not illegal.
(4) OK, it’s illegal but Hillary and Obama something, something so it’s OK.
(5) Get over it, Libturd, you’re just a sore loser!
Kathy Griffin is an idiot. Class 1.
What a disgusting thing to do.
neilm
3
Kathy Griffin is an idiot. Class 1.
What a disgusting thing to do.
Do I even want to know what she did? [Googling what she did, BRB]
Okay... that is beyond the pale. Sick. That is probably the worst I've seen from either side... right up there with "Obama" hung in effigy and set on fire. Disgusting. :^(
There are two big battles looming, though, that do have a hard deadline. The federal fiscal year ends in September, meaning next year's budget is theoretically supposed to be in place by the first of October. Trump was months late with his budget proposal, and so far neither house of Congress has produced much of anything in the way of budget bills. This means the fight will consume all of September, and the end result may be nothing more than yet another omnibus bill or continuing resolution.
Oh come on CW..
How many YEARS did Democrats let pass before doing a budget...
The Tea Party extremists will try to load the bill up with all kinds of Draconian amendments. These will have zero chance of passing the Senate, though, where Democrats still have the ability to filibuster. Democrats will make a counteroffer, which will quite likely contain some major Democratic priorities.
Ahhh.. So Republicans offer "Draconian amendments...
Democrats offer "major Democratic priorities".. :D
I spose it coulda been worse..
Ya could have said, "Democrats offer vitally needed amendments for the safety and security of this country"
heh... :D
Neil, Kick....
Kudos... I honestly would not have expected that... So, credit where credit is due..
The cynic in me is thinking, "Awww they just wanted to take the wind out of my sails!!" heh :D
It WAS a disgusting display.. But the really sad thing is that, these days, it's par for the course for politics in the here and now...
Neil,
The Five Stages of Trumpism:
(1) It’s a total lie, never happened, is fake news.
(2) It happened but it’s not a big deal.
(3) OK, it might be a big deal but it’s not illegal.
(4) OK, it’s illegal but Hillary and Obama something, something so it’s OK.
(5) Get over it, Libturd, you’re just a sore loser!
The Five Stages of Obama'ism:
(1) It’s a total lie, never happened, is fake news.
(2) It happened but it’s not a big deal.
(3) OK, it might be a big deal but it’s not illegal.
(4) OK, it’s illegal but Bush and Republicans something, something so it’s OK.
(5) Get over it, Rethuglican, you’re just a sore loser!
Yep, It STILL works.. :D
Normally, I steer clear of affairs of the heart..
Huma Abedin has invited Anthony Weiner back home
http://nypost.com/2017/05/30/huma-abedin-has-invited-anthony-weiner-back-home/
On the other hand, with NOT-45's girl Friday, political maneuvering is ALWAYS just under the surface..
On the third hand, I am wracking my brain to find the political plus of this...
On the fourth (and final) hand, it seems that Abedin and NOT-45 share a taste for horrible, horrible men...
Which makes it an affair of the heart...
Which means I steer clear of it...
:D
neilm,kick
Let's face it, the US pale has an awfully big hole in it. Where do find a good tinker these days? Damn.
neilm-1
The Tea Party was founded on the principle of wobbly and is in a perpetual state of same. So is Trump for that matter, but Trump is older and was literally waised on wobbly (apologies to Joni Mitchell) by his father and his other father Roy Cohen. Wobbly is a constant and can be factored out of the political equation.
I am pretty sure Kathy G. has been in the news about: 1) head and 2) poor taste, before, but Google is so plugged up with the most recent incident that I can't confirm this. She is no stranger to poor taste and has learned to apologize quickly.
She is no stranger to poor taste and has learned to apologize quickly.
But what's different about this case is that she USUALLY has the Left Wingery firmly behind her...
But not this time..
Hopefully it's the start of a civilized trend.. :D
We'll know more if Paula chimes in.. :D
WHITE HOUSE SAYS TRUMP EXPECTED TO PULL US FROM PARIS DEAL
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_TRUMP_CLIMATE?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2017-05-31-09-01-31
About frakin' time!!! :D
I have to admit... If Trump backed out of backing it, it might have been a deal breaker for me...
I have to admit... If Trump backed out of backing it, it might have been a deal breaker for me...
Carp!!!
That should read...
If Trump backed out of backing out, it might have been a deal breaker for me...
Damn, and it was such a cute play on words too!!! :D
Michale wrote:
"About frakin' time!!! :D"
So you think it's a GREAT idea that the USA is going to be one of only THREE countries in the ENTIRE world, not to be part of the climate deal??? You do know that the other two are Sandinista Nicaragua, and Assad's Syria, right?
I assume you also know how much that is going to damage us both diplomatically and economically? Renewable energy is approaching being a 3 TRILLION dollar industry. And other countries while have the right to slap tariffs on American industrial goods because of our carbon footprint.
Still sound like a great deal all around to you to withdraw from it???
Oh, by the way, I think Kathy Griffin's stunt was pretty disgusting too.
@JM,
good point about the economic impact of withdrawing from the paris climate agreement. even IF global warming weren't as factually supported as it is, and even IF it were all a gigantic money-making hoax perpetrated by al gore, the financial cost of pulling out would still be astronomically high.
The GOP is literally the last unpaid group left in the world that doesn't believe not only that Climate change isn't real, but that it isn't about to do serious harm to the planet. Note that even the Saudis have signed onto the Paris agreement.
Climate Change deniers, Gun rights activists, Death Penalty advocates, and Creationists all make the US look to the rest of the world like the last great bastion of ignorance, like the world's largest Trailer Park, led by a confederacy of dunces.
Hey, did'ya see where the US Coal Museum in Kentucky has switched to Solar Power? That's how absurd this has all become. But then, I suppose we should get used to being snickered at by the rest of the world for the next few years.
The GOP is the last unpaid group left in the world that doesn't believe that climate change is real, and that it isn't about to do serious harm to the planet.
*******************************
I really have to make it a habit to have a full cup of coffee before posting after I wake up.
So you think it's a GREAT idea that the USA is going to be one of only THREE countries in the ENTIRE world, not to be part of the climate deal???
Yes, I do...
I think it's the best idea in the world..
Just like I think it's a great idea if the US pulls out of an agreement that's going to cost the US trillions of dollars and millions of jobs on the basis of belief in the tooth fairy...
The GOP is literally the last unpaid group left in the world that doesn't believe not only that Climate change isn't real,
And there ya'all go again, changing the argument because you can't address the FACTS...
*NO ONE* doubts that the climate is changing...
and that it isn't about to do serious harm to the planet.
And yet, the planet will survive...
Just as it has survived ALL the climate changes since the planet began...
Oh, by the way, I think Kathy Griffin's stunt was pretty disgusting too.
Doesn't surprise me in the least... :D
and that it isn't about to do serious harm to the planet.
And ya'all's plan will prevent it???
No, it won't... Humans can no more control the climate than they can control the weather...
ANYONE who actually thinks that humans can stop the climate from changing is either a total and complete moron and a fool or has a partisan/ideological agenda...
Either/or...
ANYONE who actually thinks that humans can stop the climate from changing is either a total and complete moron and a fool or has a partisan/ideological agenda...
FOr the record, I don't believe anyone here is a total and completely moron and a fool...
Just wanted to make that clear...
ANYONE who actually thinks that humans can stop the climate from changing is either a total and complete moron and a fool or has a partisan/ideological agenda...
Heh. Tell that to ExxonMobil Stockholders, who just voted to force the company to disclose the impact of climate change on their business.
I'm always amazed by Republicans who insist that they're right, and the entire rest of the world is wrong. Moronic arrogance.
For the record, I don't believe that anyone here is an arrogant moron...
Just wanted to make that clear.
Heh. Tell that to ExxonMobil Stockholders, who just voted to force the company to disclose the impact of climate change on their business.
And if we were talking about the impact of the changing climate on a business, you would have a very good argument..
But we're talking about the human technological capability to control the planet's climate..
So you don't...
I'm always amazed by Republicans who insist that they're right, and the entire rest of the world is wrong.
When you are changing the Republicans argument to something they are not arguing, JUST so you can defeat it...???
Why is that amazing???
But we're talking about the human technological capability to control the planet's climate
You're trying to bury the argument. We know that this round of climate change is man-made, and we'd like to undo the damage that we've done by reducing greenhouse emissions. Emerging energy technologies will produce just as many jobs as the fossil fuels industry, and will lead to far fewer wars, by most estimation. Most of the countries of the world view that as no small side effect.
Don't you want to see Russia's, Saudi Arabia's, Iran's, Nigeria's, Venezuela's and the Sultanates' malevolent influence reduced around the world?
We know that this round of climate change is man-made,
No.. You THINK it is and there is some scientific data to support your claim..
But there is also scientific data, just as valid, that DOESN'T support your claim, that supports a different..
You have FAITH that your data is correct and the other data is wrong...
Humans can't control the weather. This is fact..
Climate is so much above weather as we are above cockroaches...
And YOU think that humans can control the climate!??
That's ludicrous...
Emerging energy technologies will produce just as many jobs as the fossil fuels industry, and will lead to far fewer wars, by most estimation.
Those estimations have been going on for over 60 years..
And there is NOTHING tangible to show for it...
and we'd like to undo the damage that we've done by reducing greenhouse emissions.
Those greenhouse emissions have increased dramatically..
Why haven't global temperatures followed suit??
Why is there minimal if ANY warming..
Obviously your theory is flawed... Your theory is flawed because it's a POLITICAL theory. An ideological theory...
It's not a scientific theory... If it were, then it would encompass ALL the science, not just the "science" you WANT to believe..
It's religious-esque faith... Pure and simple..
No.. You THINK it is and there is some scientific data to support your claim..But there is also scientific data, just as valid, that DOESN'T support your claim, that supports a different..
The reason that the Paris agreement was possible at all is that, except for in a few select enclaves, the science is pretty settled. Among actual scientists, deniers are very few and far between.
It's far more settled than, for instance, the assertion that tax breaks for billionaires lead to significant improvement in the financial lives of the middle class. Now that's voodoo.
The reason that the Paris agreement was possible at all is that, except for in a few select enclaves, the science is pretty settled
Anyone who thinks science.. REAL science... is EVER settled is pushing an ideological/political agenda..
REAL science is NEVER "settled"...
But, let's play your game..
Let's say the Paris Climate accord is UNIVERSALLY accepted and WORKS exactly as planned...
It will cost the US trillions of dollars and MILLIONS in lost jobs..
ALL to shave LESS than a degree over a hundred year span...
Big whoopee doo....
The Climate Change religion, like ALL religions, is nothing more than putting control of the masses into the hands of a few elites...
That's ALL it is...
Among actual scientists, deniers are very few and far between.
Even if that were so, which it is not, it would be because those scientists have been attacked, vilified, extorted, blackmailed and persecuted by those within the Human Caused Global Warming religion..
If you have to attack, vilify, extort, blackmail and persecute someone to push your position....????
Maybe your position isn't the valid one...
How about you find one scientist that denies man's impact on climate change who does NOT get paid for their opinion. Just one! Just one that doesn't get their funding from Big Oil's lobbying wing... And make sure their background is actually in the study of the climate and not a different/unrelated branch of science. Unless you are willing to let a geologist do your prostate exam, then let's just agree that they must be from the appropriate field of study to be considered an "expert".
Fact is that the Republicans are well aware that climate change is real -- our military strategy for defending our country points to it as being a major challenge we will face in the coming years. Heck, even Exxon and other oil corporations are willing to acknowledge the threat exists more than the Republicans in office will.
So what is the difference between Kathy Griffin's photo of her holding a bloody head that is supposed to belong to Trump and DHSS Chief Gen. John Kelly telling Trump that he can use the saber given to him at the Coast Guard graduation on members of the press?
One used words, the other visual imagery to express the same message.
Neither should be acceptable in a modern society, yet Trump only took issue with one of the two. And Trump had no words of condemnation for Ted Nugent's comments saying Obama and Hillary deserved the same fate -- far from it!
The Climate Change religion, like ALL religions,
Characterizing confidence in science as 'religion' is a nice attempt at judo, but religion doesn't require that its texts go through the sort of rigorous peer review that actual science requires.
...is nothing more than putting control of the masses into the hands of a few elites..
To the contrary, renewable resources like solar and wind power have freed millions from the grid, and freed States like Germany to give Putin and his oil oligarchy the middle finger. Imagine what we could accomplish diplomatically if countries weren't constantly having to jostle for energy resources, and elites weren't putting all that oil money to corrupt and nefarious purposes. Who, after all, funds Isis? We do, through oil, but by a lot less now than previously, and hopefully, by a lot less more in the future.
Clinton made the same point during his presidency: even if you don't agree with the science of Climate Change, you've got to admit that the benefits of alternative energy are pretty good.
religion is founded on belief, science is founded on doubt.
if a religion asserts that god flooded the earth, there's no conclusive way to disprove this, and even if there were, when you said it, other believers would still believe it.
if a scientist asserts that co2 levels are at 400ppm, and prior to 1950 they hadn't been higher than 300ppm for half a million years (over three times as long as the human race has existed), he'd better have a way to prove it, or else other scientists will not accept his measurements.
climate science doesn't function as a religion because what we currently know is proven with hard data, and every time new data are collected, our consensus has to adjust. science is rarely if ever precise, but little by little it approaches a full, factual, undeniable explanation of our world.
JL
Characterizing confidence in science as 'religion' is a nice attempt at judo, but religion doesn't require that its texts go through the sort of rigorous peer review that actual science requires.
But when one only accepts the science that confirms their ideology, it's faith...
Clinton made the same point during his presidency: even if you don't agree with the science of Climate Change, you've got to admit that the benefits of alternative energy are pretty good.
And if the hysterical Left could espouse that good without any of the fear-mongering or persecution, then you wouldn't hear a peep from me...
How about you find one scientist that denies man's impact on climate change who does NOT get paid for their opinion. Just one! Just one that doesn't get their funding from Big Oil's lobbying wing...
Oh puulleeezzee...
Do you know how many MILLIONS of dollars pro-human caused global warming scientists get in the form of pay and grants???
If you REALLY want bring up the money angle, your scientists are as dirty as the other scientists you condemn..
On another note...
Clinton: ‘I Take Responsibility for Every Decision I Made, but That’s Not Why I Lost’
http://freebeacon.com/politics/clinton-i-take-responsibility-every-decision-but-not-why-i-lost/
Why can't she just go away??
NO ONE wants her around any more... She is completely and unequivocally incapable of taking ANY blame for her loss..
She is a millstone around the neck of the Democrat Party and is doing nothing but dragging them down.. Every time she opens her mouth she proves beyond ANY doubt why Americans elected Donald Trump...
Democrats need to deal with NOT-45 or she is going to cost them more elections in 2018 and 2020...
If you have to attack, vilify, extort, blackmail and persecute someone to push your position....????
Maybe your position isn't the valid one...
Uncommented???
Silence gives assent.. :D
if a scientist asserts that co2 levels are at 400ppm, and prior to 1950 they hadn't been higher than 300ppm for half a million years (over three times as long as the human race has existed),
And if science "proves" that higher CO2 levels equals increased global temperatures and if CO2 levels have exploded...
Where are the "exploding" increased global temps???
climate science doesn't function as a religion because what we currently know is proven with hard data,
"Hard" data that is tweaked and jimmied to give the politically correct conclusion isn't HARD data by ANY stretch of the definition..
And if science "proves" that higher CO2 levels equals increased global temperatures and if CO2 levels have exploded...
Where are the "exploding" increased global temps??
the excess of heat has been mostly absorbed by the oceans and melting polar ice. however, surface temperatures have increased overall as well; sixteen of the seventeen warmest years on record have occurred since 2001.
"Hard" data that is tweaked and jimmied to give the politically correct conclusion isn't HARD data by ANY stretch of the definition..
and you have evidence of this? who did this alleged tweaking and jimmying? how? how much?
JL
the excess of heat has been mostly absorbed by the oceans and melting polar ice.
That's a theory that has yet to be proven... And there are facts and science that dispute that theory.
But it sure is a mighty convenient, eh? :D
and you have evidence of this?
Yer kidding, right???
Whistleblower: NOAA Scientists Manipulated Temperature Data To Make Global Warming Seem Worse
http://dailycaller.com/2017/02/05/noaa-scientists-manipulated-temperature-data-to-make-global-warming-seem-worse/
And take note.. Unlike ya'all's "anonymous sources" that ya'all take as fact, this whistle blower went on the record....
There is ample factual data that the NOAA, NASA and other human caused global warming fear-mongering agencies have manipulated and tweaked and jimmied the data to fit the politically correct theory..
NOAA/NASA Dramatically Altered US Temperatures After The Year 2000
https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2014/06/23/noaanasa-dramatically-altered-us-temperatures-after-the-year-2000/
Climate-change ‘hiatus’ disappears with new data
US agency’s updated temperature records suggest that global warming continues apace.
http://www.nature.com/news/climate-change-hiatus-disappears-with-new-data-1.17700
NOAA’s National Climatic Data Center caught cooling the past – modern processed records don’t match paper records
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/06/06/noaas-national-climatic-data-center-caught-cooling-the-past-modern-processed-records-dont-match-paper-records/
You asked for "evidence"...
There it is.. And tons more where that came from..
There it is.. And tons more where that came from..
i'm open to the "tons more" part, but each of the reports cited so far have been criticized for misstating or misquoting the data as reported, by the individuals who gathered the data and did the reporting. i have to leave the house for the day, but here's the first:
Bates himself downplayed any suggestion of misconduct. “The issue here is not an issue of tampering with data, but rather really of timing of a release of a paper that had not properly disclosed everything it was,” he told reporter Scott Waldman. And Bates told ScienceInsider that he is wary of his critique becoming a talking point for those skeptical of human-caused climate change. But it was important for this conversation about data integrity to happen, he says. “That’s where I came down after a lot of soul searching. I knew people would misuse this. But you can't control other people,” he says.
http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2017/02/how-culture-clash-noaa-led-flap-over-high-profile-warming-pause-study
i.e. climate skeptics may attempt to use differences among scientists to cast doubt on the validity of the process, but in fact those differences are evidence that the process is working.
i.e. climate skeptics may attempt to use differences among scientists to cast doubt on the validity of the process, but in fact those differences are evidence that the process is working.
The differences result in demonization and persecution of scientists who don't toe the human caused global warming line..
You have a funny definition of "working"...
Big business and corporate interests are BEGGING President Trump to stay with the Paris Climate bunk..
That's the BEST argument to get OUT of it..
Funny how ya'all are on the same exact side of Big Corporatists....
Party Uber Alles...
Watching the announcement Live...
If Trump doesn't unilaterally and totally pull out of the Paris fear-mongering, it may very well be the tipping point for me...
Looks definite that President Trump will put America first...
Nice....
https://www.commentarymagazine.com/politics-ideas/goodbye-paris-accord-climate/
The Paris fear-mongering was total and complete fraud from beginning to end..
President Trump's wisdom in pulling the US out of this fraud should be applauded...
neilm [2] -
OK, now that was funny!
:-)
-CW
michale [5] -
I didn't assign blame on this one. Both parties are equally at fault on it. I forget when we last had a real budget (something like 13 separate bills). 2003? 1998? It's certainly been awhile, and both parties share in this particular blame.
Happy?
-CW
TheStig [10] -
Shouldn't you be apologizing to the IWW?
Heh. Couldn't resist...
-CW
Balthasar [16] -
OK, I'll bite. Got a link for that "Coal museum goes solar" story? that's pretty funny...
-CW
michale [52] -
OK, throughout this discussion (which happened before Thursday's announcement, obviously), you state that Trump not bailing on Paris would be a tipping point for you.
Obviously, it didn't tip, Trump did what you wanted.
But this got me thinking, what else would Trump have to go back on for you to reach a tipping point? If you don't have an answer right now, that's OK, but I would be interested to hear updates like the one in this thread. I am very curious as to what it would take for Trump supporters to flip on him -- mostly because it hasn't happened in meaningful numbers yet. So let me know if any of these other decision points do it for you, that's all I'm really asking...
-CW