Friday Talking Points -- Quid, Meet Quo
The impeachment whirlwind shows no signs of slowing down, and in fact each day brings more and more evidence that President Donald Trump is using American foreign policy as his own personal opposition research to undermine his Democratic political opponents. Which, of course, is an eminently impeachable offense.
This week alone, we've learned: that Trump's attorney general has been pressuring Italy and Australia (and, most likely, other countries as well) to help out with the investigation into the conspiracy theory that the Mueller investigation was improperly begun; that Trump begged the leader of China for some dirt on both Joe Biden and Elizabeth Warren during a phone call; that Rudy Giuliani sent a document dump to the State Department outlining his version of various conspiracy theories -- including one against the U.S. ambassador to Ukraine (who was later removed from her post); that Trump held out both the military aid to Ukraine and a personal White House meeting in what can only be called a quid pro quo arrangement; that Trump thinks there is nothing wrong with any of this as evidenced by his begging China for dirt on Biden while the television cameras were rolling; that there is a second whistleblower accusing a Trump political appointee with attempting to influence the I.R.S. in their audits of Trump's tax returns; and that Trump wanted to shoot people crossing the southern border in the legs or possibly build a moat on the border and fill it with alligators and snakes. Trump later denied this in a tweet about a "Moot stuffed with alligators," because of course he did.
And all of that was before the text message dump. Just another fun week in Trumpland!
Last night, text messages between former special envoy to Ukraine Kurt Volker, U.S. chargé d'affaires in our Kiev embassy Bill Taylor, and the U.S. ambassador to the European Union Gordon Sondland were released, which clearly show how all three were working behind the scenes to explicitly pressure the new Ukrainian leader to do exactly what Trump and Rudy Giuliani wanted -- open investigations into their conspiracy theories about the 2016 election and about Hunter and Joe Biden. The quid pro quo is so obvious that at the end of the chain of texts Sondland -- who, unlike the other two is not a career diplomat, but rather a political appointee -- felt it was necessary to state that nobody should use the phrase quid pro quo and the three should be calling each other instead of leaving a paper trail of texts.
To call these texts stunning is understating the case. Calling them a smoking gun might be more accurate. Here are just a few of excerpts:
Taylor: "Are we now saying that security assistance and WH meeting are conditioned on investigations?"
Volker (to Andrey Yermak, top advisor to Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky): "Heard from the White House. Assuming President Z convinces trump he will investigate/ 'get to the bottom of what happened in 2016, we will nail down date for visit to Washington."
Yermak to Volker: "Once we have a date, will call for a press briefing, announcing upcoming visit and outlining vision for the US-UKRAINE relationship, including among other things Burisma and election meddling in investigations."
Burisma is the gas company that employed Hunter Biden, of course.
Taylor: "I think it's crazy to withhold security assistance for help with a political campaign"
Sondland paused for five hours here, perhaps to consult with a lawyer or two, and then texted back in suspiciously formal language: "Bill, I believe you are incorrect about President Trump's intentions. The president has been crystal clear no quid pro quo's of any kind. The President is trying to evaluate whether Ukraine is truly going to adopt the transparency and reforms that President Zelensky promised during his campaign. I suggest we stop the back and forth by text."
This is a pretty transparent attempt at covering his ass, quite obviously. Perhaps his worst nightmare was that the whole text thread would someday figure in a congressional investigation... which is precisely what just happened.
These are just some of the texts -- there are plenty of others, including one in which the diplomats pass around a draft of a statement they want the Ukrainian president to make, which explicitly promises to get to the bottom of Rudy's conspiracy theories.
It is crystal clear throughout all of these that (1) a White House meeting with the Ukrainian president is the carrot they are dangling to pressure him to investigate both Hillary Clinton's servers and Hunter Biden, and, later on, (2) that blocking the military aid promised to Ukraine is the stick to increase the pressure on the Ukrainian president to do exactly what Trump and Giuliani want him to do. There can be no doubt of either of these things, in fact. Quid, meet quo.
Trump has now moved on to a rather novel defense -- sure, he did it, but hey, presidents do this sort of thing all the time and he would in fact be negligent in his duties if he didn't pressure foreign governments to dig up dirt on his political opponents. This is why he flat-out said he was thinking about pressuring the Chinese for more dirt on Hunter Biden (to prove a separate conspiracy theory Rudy holds dear). On camera, in front of the world, Trump just self-impeached.
You just can't make this stuff up, folks. Here's how the Washington Post began their report of this stunning admission:
President Trump on Thursday appealed to a foreign country to take action involving his electoral opponents. It was the third time we know of that he has done so.
The first time, when Trump asked Russia to find Hillary Clinton's "missing emails," his campaign insisted he was joking. The second time, when Trump asked Ukraine's president to launch two other politically convenient investigations, we learned about it only after the administration tried to keep it under wraps.
Now, for his third act -- this one involving China -- Trump just came out and said it.
In Trump's own words:
And by the way, likewise, China should start an investigation into the Bidens because what happened in China is just about as bad as what happened with Ukraine.
When asked whether he had brought the matter up with Chinese President Xi Jinping, Trump answered:
I haven't, but it's certainly something we can start thinking about because I'm sure that President Xi does not like being under that kind of scrutiny where billions of dollars is taken out of his country by a guy that just got kicked out of the Navy. He got kicked out of the Navy. All of a sudden he's getting billions of dollars. You know what they call that? They call that a payoff.
Actually, a payoff would be if Trump sweetened a trade deal with China in exchange for dirt on his political opponent. Or offered a visit to the White House to the Ukrainian president. Or withheld military aid to get dirt on the Bidens.
What's really stunning is that all of this was already out in the open in Ukraine long before the Trump phone call:
One Ukrainian oligarch in particular, a figure close to President Volodymyr Zelensky, claims to have first-hand knowledge of Giuliani's activities because, he says, Giuliani's business associates tried to rope him into the scheme. When this Ukrainian business tycoon, Ihor Kolomoisky, rejected Giuliani's request for help, Giuliani attacked him on Twitter and called for him to be investigated. Kolomoisky then gave an on-the-record interview on Ukrainian television in which he predicted that Giuliani was soon going to be the center of a "big scandal" in the United States.
In May, Kolomoisky told Ukrainian media, in an interview barely noticed in Washington, that two of Giuliani's business associates, Lev Parnas and Igor Fruman, came to visit him in Israel in April to "demand" he set up a meeting between Giuliani and Zelensky. This was months before Ambassador Kurt Volker eventually did set up a meeting between Giuliani and Zelensky's adviser Andriy Yermak.
"They wanted to have a meeting with Zelensky and show Giuliani that they had organized everything," Kolomoisky said. "A big scandal may break out, and not only in Ukraine, but in the United States. That is, it may turn out to be a clear conspiracy against Biden."
. . .
"Look, there is Giuliani, and there [are] two clowns, Lev Parnas and Igor Fruman, who were milking the bull here. They are Giuliani's clients," Kolomoisky told the Ukrainska Pravda website. "They came here and told us that they would organize a meeting with Zelensky. They allegedly struck a deal with [Prosecutor-general Yuriy] Lutsenko about the fate of this criminal case -- Burisma, [former vice president] Biden, meddling in the U.S. election and so on."
That was back in May -- long before the rest of the story unfolded.
The head of the Federal Election Commission retweeted something she had originally sent out months ago, with the line: "Is this thing on?" and an image of a microphone, just in case anyone was unclear on the illegality of all of this:
Let me make something 100% clear to the American public and anyone running for public office. It is illegal for any person to solicit, accept, or receive anything of value from a foreign national in connection with a U.S. election.
So far, Republicans are desperately trying to keep up with Trump's shifting storyline, although a few of them have jumped off this crazy train already. Mitt Romney tweeted out his feelings today:
When the only American citizen President Trump singles out for China's investigation is his political opponent in the midst of the Democratic nomination process, it strains credulity to suggest that it is anything other than politically motivated.
By all appearances, the President's brazen and unprecedented appeal to China and to Ukraine to investigate Joe Biden is wrong and appalling.
Other Republicans are avoiding the media and the public, for obvious reasons. It's easier to hide than to try to defend the indefensible, after all.
At this point one has to wonder two things, which are somewhat contradictory in nature. First, do we really even need anything further to prove that Trump should be impeached and removed from office? And second, as the investigations continue apace, what else is going to be uncovered? We aren't even two weeks in to the impeachment inquiry, and we've already had document dumps and testimony from two separate inspectors general, testimony from a diplomat who quit his post last week specifically so he could tell the truth to Congress, multiple breaking stories about how deep both this collusion and the coverup went, and Trump himself opening up a whole new line of impeachable behavior on camera. And, again, that's before we even take the new texts into account. At this pace, you have to wonder what's going to come out in the next week.
Throughout it all, the most amusing thing is that Trump is convinced that he's the master of manipulation and he doesn't need any help crafting his message as he tries to explain away his obviously-impeachable behavior. He just keeps digging the hole deeper, to be blunt. Some of these efforts are downright delusional -- it was even reported that Trump is trying to sweet-talk House Democrats in vulnerable districts to vote against impeaching him. Good luck with that, Skippy!
Up until now, we've all wondered (and feared) what Trump might do in an actual crisis. We are now getting an answer to that, and it isn't pretty. Trump is spiraling completely out of control, and things are going to get far worse very soon, if the past week is any indication. Buckle up, folks, because this is going to be a very wild ride.
If we had, say, $27 for every time a pundit wrote off Bernie Sanders's campaign, we'd have... well... $25 million. That's the amount Bernie raised in the third quarter of the year, and it is also the highest number any Democratic candidate has yet posted in any fundraising quarter.
Bernie Sanders has the most-admired donor list of any Democrat in politics, which that impressive total shows beyond a shadow of a doubt. Elizabeth Warren is catching up -- her third quarter fundraising total was only slightly behind Bernie's -- and both of them are proving that relying on small donors rather than holding high-priced events for fatcats is indeed a viable strategy for a presidential candidate. Bernie already proved this the last time around, in fact, but he's proving it all over again this time.
The press either refuses to cover Bernie's campaign, or they write smug articles about how Bernie's campaign is "in trouble." His supporters continue to back his revolutionary call, however, and he's shown he's not going anywhere any time soon.
We also have to add a personal note, wishing Bernie a full recovery from his recent heart stent procedure. He's already confirmed that he will indeed be in the fourth Democratic debate, which is less than two weeks away now. Get well soon, Bernie, and get back out there on the campaign trail!
For his record-setting fundraising number alone, though, it was a pretty easy choice to award Bernie Sanders the Most Impressive Democrat Of The Week this week. Outraising candidates who do rely on big donors is an incredibly impressive feat. So is sticking to your principles of only relying on small donors throughout the whole campaign.
[Congratulate Senator Bernie Sanders on his Senate contact page, to let him know you appreciate his efforts.]
Perhaps we missed something during the whole impeachment circus, but we just don't seem to have any Democrat who massively disappointed us this week. So we'll have to put the Most Disappointing Democrat Of The Week award back on the shelf for another week, unless someone's got a nomination to make in the comments.
Volume 545 (10/4/19)
Most of the talking points this week deal with the impeachment public relations battle. At the end, however, we've got yet another "conservative denouncing Trump" opinion piece, this time from a Fox News legal analyst. Which includes the phrases "crazies who crave violence" and "a dog whistle to the deranged," so you've got all of that to look forward to.
Enough introduction, though, let's just dig in....
Do-Nothing Mitch and Do-Nothing Donald
This is crucial. Democrats believe, with good reason, that Bill Clinton survived impeachment by continuing to get things done throughout the process. Trump is trying to turn this on House Democrats, calling them "do-nothing Democrats." So turn it right back around!
"It is laughable that Donald Trump thinks House Democrats are doing nothing. In fact, the House has passed hundreds of bills -- on gun safety, on fighting election interference, on prescription drugs, on all sorts of important issues -- that are being completely ignored by Mitch McConnell over in the Senate. House Democrats do indeed want to get things done, and they are leading by example. Meanwhile, Mitch is so terrified that Trump is going to support a bill one day and then denounce it the next that he's in a defensive crouch. He hasn't passed anything because he's waiting for Trump to tell him what to do. If the label 'do-nothing' is going to be used, let's use it correctly, because what's really going on is that Do-Nothing Mitch is following Do-Nothing Donald's orders. We could pass all sorts of compromise bills next week, if Mitch and Trump would only get off their rear ends and act."
Collusion most foul
The shifting nature of defining this word can now work in Democrats' favor.
"You know what I'd like to ask Donald Trump right now? I'd like to ask him how he defines the word collusion. He spent over two years insisting that there was 'no collusion' between him, his campaign, and Russia, after all. Now we've got Trump colluding with a foreign government to provide political help to his re-election effort in Trump's own words. This is a textbook definition of collusion, in fact. Trump is colluding with foreign governments right out in the open now, as he just attempted to do with China. There is collusion everywhere you look -- collusion out the wazoo! After insisting for two years that he hadn't colluded with Russia, Trump now apparently believes that it's OK to collude with any country on the planet -- on live television, no less. So I'd dearly love to hear some journalist ask him what his current definition of the word collusion is."
Quid pro quo, doubly so
Those texts make this so painfully obvious, so hammer it home!
"When the Ukraine call was first released, Donald Trump insisted there was no quid pro quo. Now that the texts between the diplomats have been made public, it is patently obvious that there was indeed not just one quid pro quo instance, but two. Trump dangled the carrot of a personal meeting at the White House with him to the Ukrainians, and then he doubled down by using the stick of withholding military aid -- both directly intended to pressure the Ukrainians to open investigations into his political rivals. It is impossible to call either of these things anything but a quid pro quo, in fact. Do what Trump and Rudy want, and you can visit the White House and we'll release the hundreds of millions of dollars of military aid. Don't do what they want, and you get no visit and no aid. There's just no other way to read it, folks."
Just the icing on the impeachment cake
This is worth pointing out, over and over again.
"Trump committed an impeachable offense merely by asking a foreign leader for dirt on his political opponent. Even if he never actually got any dirt, even if they refused, and even if nothing else was involved, this is already an impeachable offense. Trump doesn't understand this, and tried to deny there was any kind of quid pro quo at all, but even without it, Trump has still been caught doing something illegal. The quid pro quo -- which is obvious to anyone who has read those diplomatic texts -- is merely the icing on the impeachment cake. It is not strictly necessary to impeach the president, it merely makes the case that much stronger."
What more proof does anyone need?
This is a useful all-around talking point, from this point onward.
"Seriously -- what more proof does anyone need that Trump deserves impeachment? It's all right there, and most of it is in Trump's own words. Gathering further evidence will just make the articles of impeachment a little longer and more detailed, but at this point it isn't even all that necessary. Seriously, after reading the call transcript and those texts, what more proof does anyone need?"
This is not normal
Trump, by inviting China to the collusion party, is attempting to "normalize" such behavior. Don't let him get away with it.
"Does it really even need to be said? This is not normal. This is not what United States presidents do. This is not the way our founders imagined American foreign policy would be conducted. It is in no way normal for a president to look into the cameras and invite China to dig up dirt on Trump's political opponent. It is in no way normal to offer a quid pro quo to a foreign leader to provide such dirt, either. Not only is none of this normal in any way, shape, or form, it is in fact solid evidence that Trump must be removed from office, because he quite obviously does not understand either his oath of office or the Constitution he swore that oath to uphold."
A dog whistle to the deranged
We close today with our recurring "conservative denouncing Trump" segment. This time we've got a scathing article written by Fox News in-house legal expert Judge Andrew Napolitano. Here is an extended excerpt, but the whole article is well worth reading.
Has Trump committed any impeachable offenses?
A C.I.A. agent formerly assigned to the White House -- and presently referred to as the "whistleblower" -- reported a July 25, 2019 telephone conversation that Trump had with Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelensky. That conversation manifested both criminal and impeachable behavior.
The criminal behavior to which Trump has admitted is much more grave than anything alleged or unearthed by Special Counsel Robert Mueller, and much of what Mueller revealed was impeachable.
. . .
Trump has also admitted to accusing the as-yet publicly unnamed whistleblower of treason, and suggesting that the whistleblower and those who have helped him are spies and ought to be treated as spies were in "the old days" (Trump's phrase) -- that is, by hanging.
The president's allusions to violence are palpably dangerous. They will give cover to crazies who crave violence, as other intemperate words of his have done. His words have already produced offers of "bounties" in return for outing and finding the whistleblower.
Trump also suggested that his impeachment would produce a second American Civil War. This language is a dog whistle to the deranged.
. . .
Is violating campaign finance law by involving a foreign government in an American presidential campaign an impeachable offense? Yes, it is.
The expressed intention of those who wrote the Constitution and those who wrote the campaign finance laws 200 years later -- and the lesson of the post-2016 election and Mueller-investigated angst in America -- was to keep foreign governments out of the American political system.
For heaven's sake, Trump was just investigated by Mueller for two-and-a-half tumultuous years for allegedly bringing the Russian government into the 2016 election and now he has attempted in one phone call to bring the Ukrainian government into the 2020 election! Does he understand the laws he has sworn to uphold?
It was to remedy just such reckless, constitutionally destructive behavior that impeachment was intended.
-- Chris Weigant
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Cross-posted at: Democratic Underground
I quibble with number 6. It is certainly not normal for American presidents to make foreign governments meddle with internal affairs, save perhaps for the Five Eyes program. Nor, indeed, is it normal for the leader of any large, world-powerful and wealthy country to solicit such a thing.
It is, however, normal for the flimsy tyrants of small monarchies and principalities to solicit the aid of the local empire in helping said flimsy tyrant maintain control over their throne, against the collective fury of their populations. As it was with Somoza in Nicaragua, so it was with Herod in Judea, or any such client state attempting to maintain stability through bloodshed. If all the money is going towards the center of the empire, you might as well ask the emperor to pay for local security, right?
But we are not a client state; the President of the United States has never, until now, been or in any way resembled a flimsy petty tyrant; there is no practical reason for Donald Trump to be asking a FOREIGN government to be investigating a U.S. political candidate when the U.S. government has plenty of resources for that already. Even without their aid, Trump could fund an opposition research team for his campaign without even breaking the bank.
And yet -- Donald Trump decides that he's going to ask for election interference from everyone besides his own government.
I cannot understand why.
At this point one has to wonder two things, which are somewhat contradictory in nature. First, do we really even need anything further to prove that Trump should be impeached and removed from office? And second, as the investigations continue apace, what else is going to be uncovered?
Blotus has long since been impeachable if we use the word to mean "worthy of impeachment" but the problem has been the GOP's fealty-no-matter-what.
As THAT'S the real problem I think it behooves Dems to drag this out awhile because, as you note in point 2 - what else will we learn? I think we'll learn a hell of a lot. As I write this a story is breaking that another intelligence official is mulling over whether to submit a new whistle-blower complaint ALSO about Ukraine.
Meanwhile Pence has now been asked to produce Ukraine related materials, and Mulvaney. Both will probably stonewall which, hopefully, will place them (Pence at least) on the impeachment list too.
If Senate Republicans are prepared to protect Blotus they need to pay a heavy price and the more dirt Dems bring to the public the worse Republicans will look - at least to the sentient patriots among us - and we DO outnumber trumper-traitors.
AND the more that comes out the more Blotus will spin out of control and admit to more crimes/commit more crimes openly.
Media coverage is changing - it's getting more critical and less willing to let lies go unchallenged.
Right now Blotus is being actively destructive and most Repubs are in hiding - not "acting" with Blotus nor stopping him. But the more they protect Blotus, the more dirt damaging to republicans will be unearthed. The rock and hard place they're stuck in is going to get rockier and harder by the day because what they are going to have to "support" is going to get more and more unsavory. If Dems keep up pressure and keep getting more dirt and hand the Senate a strong case Republicans are going to have a rotten time dodging responsibility. They may well betray us all by letting Blotus get away with criminal behavior, but it will suck for them. And it's in Dem's interest to make that very, very clear as this unfolds because THAT is what may motivate Repubs to work behind the scenes to get Blotus to resign. That's the way out for the GOP.
I think the answer is rather simple.
Donald Trump is a bully and he can't stand the fact that someone may be better than him. And, most importantly, he has never developed anything that comes close to what might be called a moral compass. For him, anything that he needs, goes.
His internal polls suggest that Biden is his likely opponent and that he loses to Biden in most matchups and by a lot. This scares him and he is latching on to whatever he can to bring Biden down and thus remove him as a threat.
I'm pretty sure Trump can't wrap his mind around losing to Biden.
That was in response to [1], of course.
[1] suddenlyreflective:
And yet -- Donald Trump decides that he's going to ask for election interference from everyone besides his own government.
I cannot understand why.
Because Putin wants him to discredit Mueller's investigation as a step towards sanctions being lifted; he also wants to be able to invade Ukraine with impunity. The Biden angle is just the way in.
Blotus also wants to stay in power in the hopes he'll be able to quash all his legal problems and escape justice. If he's out by 2020 lots of chicken-roosting is going to happen.
CW, above:
$25 million. ... the highest number any Democratic candidate has yet posted in any fundraising quarter.
both of them are proving that relying on small donors rather than holding high-priced events for fatcats is indeed a viable strategy for a presidential candidate.
Politico, 2013:
The Obama campaign released its final fundraising figures in front of an audience of top campaign donors and bundlers Saturday, announcing that the total combined fundraising efforts brought in $1.1 billion during the 2012 cycle.
Now, those numbers aren't directly comparable. One is for a single quarter in the primaries, and the other is for an entire presidential campaign, from the earliest primary preparations right up to the general. But the point is that the inference isn't warranted. Yes, they can do some impressive primary fundraising without getting much from big donors. But that doesn't mean that it's a viable strategy overall. A presidential candidate needs both: a bunch of people who can make the maximum allowable contribution, and a much larger bunch of us whose contributions are much smaller.
By the way, in the third quarter of 2007, Hillary Clinton raised over $27M. However, part of it was in contributions for the general campaign. So $25M is still a record for primary fundraising.
"Milking the bull?"
LoL
By the way cw, i vote Hillary Clinton as most disappointing. She showed up in the media again this week, spurring suggestions that she may be a late entry into the 2020 primary. I think Hillary would have made a good president had she won, but her time is done now.
I still vote Rep. Schiff as MDDOTW award because the situation is bad enough from a partisan perspective before giving the president and his fellow Republicans ammunition to help keep the partisan fight alive and well (and, yes, I know that Schiff plays no large roll in that, but still … ) by pretending to read from the call summary you're actually making a parody out of it and telling it in your own interpretive words.
Joshua,
Please, PLEASE tell me that Secretary Clinton has less than a snowball's chance in Hell of getting into this race ...
HRC didn't spur the idea that she'd run again except among idiots.
Well, you know what, Paula, it seems ANYTHING is possible, these days ...
Paula, would you agree that there is really no role for HRC in the 2020 presidential primary and general election campaign, given all that has happened in the wake of her loss to Trump?
[11],
Hey … wait a second … what? …
[14] EM: not really. I think after the primaries are through she could be very useful with many groups because lots of us revere her. It depends on who the winner of the primary is as to how she could assist.
HRC is too much of a patriot and a team player to want to hurt the Dem nominee in any way. She won't try to upstage or anything else, but she'll help if she can. And her endorsement will mean a lot to many of us.
People who think her making public appearances hurts Dems ARE THE PEOPLE DOING THE HURTING. If they don't like her don't watch her but don't try to deprive those of us who do like her to see her occasionally.
{13}?
I may be an idiot.
Trump's situation is strangely reminiscent of the inquisition of Jesus before the High Priest (Matthew 26:65), where Jesus affirms that he is the Messiah, and the high priest tears his cloak and shouts, "What do we need witnesses for? You heard him say it."
The only thing that concerns be about her getting involved in any way or, God forbid, making a public endorsement and the like is the fact that she is a polarizing figure and not the kind of politician who is capable of trying to bridge the great divide that is American politics. Certainly not in the way that Biden can.
I just think she should stay largely out of public view, as much as I am sure it would go against every bone in her body and disappoint many Democrats who do admire and revere her. It would only add to divisiveness and polarization and make it harder for a candidate like Biden to break through some of it.
nypoet22
By the way cw, i vote Hillary Clinton as most disappointing. She showed up in the media again this week, spurring suggestions that she may be a late entry into the 2020 primary. I think Hillary would have made a good president had she won, but her time is done now.
Are you kidding me??? Hillary was on Rachel Maddow’s show push the new book that she and her daughter wrote, Gutsy Women. It was being released that day.
There was NOTHING said in that interview that made it seem like she was even interested in running again, and so unless Hillary is outlawed from being seen in public at any time a full year before our elections... giving her the MDDOTW is ludicrous!
Paula,
People who think her making public appearances hurts Dems ARE THE PEOPLE DOING THE HURTING. If they don't like her don't watch her but don't try to deprive those of us who do like her to see her occasionally.
Thank you! I watched the interview, it was interesting, but nothing she said even hinted that she wants to run again.
It is telling that both Ukraine and China, two countries known internationally for their corruption, have publicly stated that they are not interested in being involved in Trump’s corruption of our elections.
1. Does Individual 1 care whether actual dirt is dug up or fake dirt is manufactured? The people who shout 'witch hunt' for him would be the first to claim 'under investigation' = guilty for the Bidens or any other Dem.
2. It seems likely that Individual 1 and his close associates see everyone else through the filter of their own way of life and can't understand that anyone could be different. That is, they actually believe 'everyone' is on the take. 'No one' is honest in business or personal dealings. Lying is 'normal' business procedure. 'Everyone' is racist, misogynist, etc. They believe they are just better at it than most. Getting away with it for so long would just confirm that belief.
That's not to say that there aren't too many people like that, in and out of politics, or that mainly honest people don't sometimes stumble, but this kind of dishonest and venality are surely not universal.
The impeachment whirlwind shows no signs of slowing down, and in fact each day brings more and more evidence that President Donald Trump is using American foreign policy as his own personal opposition research to undermine his Democratic political opponents. Which, of course, is an eminently impeachable offense.
Yea??? Any FACTS to support that??
I mean, com'on.. Let's face reality..
Due to ya'all's HHPTDS, ya'all think that President Trump farting in public is an "impeachable offense"..
Ya'all wanted President Trump impeached even before he took office.
Like I said.. Let's face reality, since this is a reality based forum..
For ya'all, Trumping wiping the floor with Hillary is the "impeachable offense" here.. :eyeroll:
Up until now, we've all wondered (and feared) what Trump might do in an actual crisis. We are now getting an answer to that, and it isn't pretty. Trump is spiraling completely out of control, and things are going to get far worse very soon, if the past week is any indication. Buckle up, folks, because this is going to be a very wild ride.
This is... whaa?? The tenth time ya have made almost that exact same claim?? 12th?? 20th??
But THIS time... THIS time yer right, eh?? :D
We also have to add a personal note, wishing Bernie a full recovery from his recent heart stent procedure. He's already confirmed that he will indeed be in the fourth Democratic debate, which is less than two weeks away now. Get well soon, Bernie, and get back out there on the campaign trail!
Actually, it was a heart attack...
Bernie is done.. His campaign is over..
Perhaps we missed something during the whole impeachment circus, but we just don't seem to have any Democrat who massively disappointed us this week. So we'll have to put the Most Disappointing Democrat Of The Week award back on the shelf for another week, unless someone's got a nomination to make in the comments.
Oh puuullleeese... :eyeroll:
How about Barack Obama for throwing Biden under the bus?? How about Hunter Biden for going into hiding in a non-extradition country and leaving his dad flailing alone??
If you can't find a disappointing Democrat, it simply means you are on a euphoric high over this faux impeachment coup and aren't really looking..
I'm just sayin'
SuddenlyReflective,
A JEEP!!! :D
"Welcome to the Party, Pal!!!"
-John McClane, DIE HARD
But we are not a client state; the President of the United States has never, until now, been or in any way resembled a flimsy petty tyrant;
Where have YOU been!?? :D People around here have been accusing President Trump of acting like a flimsy petty tyrant since BEFORE he took office!! :D
there is no practical reason for Donald Trump to be asking a FOREIGN government to be investigating a U.S. political candidate when the U.S. government has plenty of resources for that already. Even without their aid, Trump could fund an opposition research
I am constrained to point out that it's well documented and proven beyond ANY doubt that President Trump can't TRUST our own investigative resources..
And yet -- Donald Trump decides that he's going to ask for election interference from everyone besides his own government.
Let me ask you something.. When did "opposition research" become "election interference"???
At what point did that occur???
I mean, if Biden is dirty in Ukraine and China, wouldn't ya'all WANT to know about it??
Everyone here would LOVE to know it if it was President Trump...
Why put ya'all's head in the ground because it's Biden??
I'm just sayin'....
Liz,
His internal polls suggest that Biden is his likely opponent and that he loses to Biden in most matchups and by a lot.
I am sure President Trump is smart enough to realize that polls this far out from the election are worse then useless..
It's ridiculous and non-serious to think that President Trump put ANY faith in ANY polls..
This scares him and he is latching on to whatever he can to bring Biden down and thus remove him as a threat.
That's more wishful thinking than any real serious position..
@Blathy,
You have NO FACTS to support your version of your fantasy law..
The law is actually very loose on this subject, ranging from treason to he “rendered himself obnoxious,” in the words of Benjamin Franklin.
Interesting that you quote FOX NEWS..
I thought YOU thought they were an unreliable source??
Oh, that's right.. They are reliable when they say what you want to hear..
For the record, Blathy.. Napalitano has been as wrong about President Trump as you have been..
So, a moron quoting a moron does not raise the credibility level one iota..
As an aside to Liz... See what I mean??
Fox News is a PERFECTLY reliable source.. As long as they are saying what Trump/America haters want to hear.. :^/
Liz,
I don't have to. Sadly, Chris allows you to tap out anything you want - quite obviously - regardless of its veracity or lack thereof.
I know that's what you have to tell yourself.. But the fact is, everything that I relay as fact IS fact and it comes with it's own supporting documentation attesting to it's fact-ness..
The problem is, ya'all don't like what the facts are telling you..
The downward plummet of Biden's campaign is a perfect example of this..
Trump is guilty of abuse of power, on several counts and on the factual basis of his own words.
No more so than Obama.
I would even say LESS than Obama because President Trump has often followed the "rules" that Obama hisself created..
Biden, on the other hand, is the epitome of integrity and devotion to country.
I know you believe that.. And I would agree, that Biden's integrity and patriotism is unusually high for a Democrat..
But the fact is, his son is a shit and has royally screwed things up for his father.
And his old boss is throwing Biden under the bus by his silence..
These are FACTS whether you agree with them or not..
}}}}Apparently, the GP in Ukraine thought there was.. And THAT is why Joe Biden had him fired.. To fade the heat from Biden's son..{{{{{
False. And, yet, you were allowed to tap it out.
I was allowed to tap it out because it's factually accurate..
And there is an sworn affidavit that proves it..
Regardless of all ya'all's fantasies of Quid Pro Quo..
The simple fact is it does not rise to the level of an impeachable offense..
Unless ya'all want to concede for the record that Obama should have been impeached for his VP's QPQ and extortion of Ukraine??
Is THAT what ya'all want to claim??
:D
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/ia/iowa_democratic_presidential_caucus-6731.html
Joe Biden's numbers continue to plummet...
I give Biden's campaign another few weeks and make an added prediction..
Biden's next debate performance is going to ba abysmal...
The FACT that Obama is not standing up for Biden proves Biden is on his own..
I'll re-iterate a point that was made yesterday that no one could refute..
Their entire argument for impeachment now rests on the idea that Biden’s candidacy makes him immune to such calls for scrutiny. But they will not and can not point to an actual law that Trump violated in the conversation. Rather, they make vague arguments about courting foreign interference in an election and potential campaign finance violations.
As with the Russia Collusion delusion, you Democrats claim all sorts of wild and bullshit accusations..
Yet, you don't have a SINGLE SOLITARY fact.
And the LAST time you tried this stunt, ya'all ended up serving President Trump's needs by having Mueller & Barr completely and utterly exonerate President Trump..
No matter how ya'all want to spin it, the facts are clear...
Ya'all's track record in taking down President Trump is abysmal... It's ZERO across the board..
But THIS time, it's gonna work?? :D
Whatever ya'all have to tell yerselves to make it thru your days.. :D
Biden snaps at reporter over Ukraine question, tells media to focus on Trump instead
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/biden-snaps-at-reporter-over-question-about-conflict-of-interest-in-ukraine-tells-media-to-focus-on-trump
Uncle Joe is getting testy.. :D
The reporter then asked if Biden's son's work created the appearance of a conflict of interest -- prompting Biden to attempt to shift the focus to President Trump.
“I’m not going to respond to that,” Biden said. “Focus on this man. What he’s doing that no president has ever done. No president.”
Yes, focus on the man that every Democrat hates..
Ignore the man behind the curtain...
:eyeroll:
AndyGaus
Trump's situation is strangely reminiscent of the inquisition of Jesus before the High Priest (Matthew 26:65), where Jesus affirms that he is the Messiah, and the high priest tears his cloak and shouts, "What do we need witnesses for? You heard him say it."
SO... Yer saying President Trump is Jesus???
OK.. I admire your loyalty to the President.. :D
It's a bit much, but hay...
Diff'rent Strokes and all that.. :D
It's funny..
In ALL of ya'all's collusion rantings and ravings over the past few years..
NO ONE has been able to point to a SINGLE LAW that says it's illegal to learn opposition research from a foreign source..
NOT... ONE... SINGLE.... LAW that supports ya'all's claim...
Why is that??
Probably because no such law exists... :D
CW: Outraising candidates who do rely on big donors is an incredibly impressive feat. So is sticking to your principles of only relying on small donors throughout the whole campaign.
While the majority of Bernie's donations are small -- I believe currently around 60 percent -- Bernie isn't "only relying on small donors" for the 2020 election cycle. :)
We’re all still trapped in Democrats’ Russia delusion
After three years, we’re still on the Russia story. The locus has shifted 500 miles west from Moscow to Kiev, and now we are consumed with the Ukraine controversy rather than the Russia probe, though it’s essentially the same thing — a battle over President Trump’s legitimacy fought out with allegations of foreign interference.
https://nypost.com/2019/10/03/were-all-still-trapped-in-democrats-russia-delusion/
Democrats will NEVER concede the legitimacy of President Trump's election..
Which is funny because all of ya'all attacked and demonized President sayin, "When Trump loses, he is never going to accept that he lost.."
Turns out that it's DEMOCRATS who can't accept that they loss thereby proving once again that Democrats are all the things they accuse President Trump of being.. :D
Democrats are trying to widen the Ukraine controversy, which centers on Trump’s mention of the Bidens on his call with his Ukrainian counterpart. They want to drag in his urging Ukraine, Australia and others to cooperate with William Barr’s investigation of the origins of the Russia probe.
There’s nothing wrong or unusual about a US president asking foreign leaders to provide information useful to his attorney general in an investigation. Why would there be? Except the president’s detractors don’t consider Barr’s investigation above-board. In fact, they consider it another form of Trump’s perfidy.
The fact that Democrats wanted to impeach Donald Trump since the day he won the election...
That's why it's IMPOSSIBLE for normal, rational patriotic Americans to do anything buy yawn and the latest Democrat shiny..
It's meaningless because Democrats are meaningless..
If you accept the premise that any information developed in a foreign country and used in American politics is election interference, then Trump’s opponents themselves were masters at leveraging Ukrainian interference during the 2016 election.
As Politico reported in 2017, Ukrainian government officials “helped Clinton’s allies research damaging information on Trump and his advisers.”
And, once again, it's impossible to care a single iota when moronic Democrats scream "COLLUSION!!!!"
Because it's clear from the definition that Hillary's actions in 2016 with the Ukrainians, a Brit and Russian intelligence that Hillary was ALL OVER foreign "interference" in the 2016 election..
But Democrats don't CARE about that.
Which simply proves (as if any more proof is needed) that it's nothing but -D vs -R bigotry and hypocrisy at work...
It ha been a dizzying 2 weeks. Trump has gone from No Collusion to Hell Yes Collusion. This does not seem to be working, although it may suggest a practical way out most people can live with:
Plead insanity (most people would find that credible)
Resign
Seek help at a Swiss Sanatorium
Devote life to Mean Twittering from the Alps
It ha been a dizzying 2 weeks. Trump has gone from No Collusion to Hell Yes Collusion.
Not factually accurate..
It has always been conceded that there was collusion between Ukraine and the US...
It's called "Obeying Treaty Stipulations"
Duh....
It ha been a dizzying 2 weeks.
Only for those who are Party slaves and/or Trump/America haters...
And another week has passed and STILL Democrats are afraid to produce the alleged "whistle blower" and her witnesses..
What are Democrats afraid of??
If their faux impeachment started under false pretenses, then it truly is nothing but a coup...
NO ONE has been able to point to a SINGLE LAW that says it's illegal to learn opposition research from a foreign source..
NOT... ONE... SINGLE.... LAW that supports ya'all's claim...
Why is that??
Probably because no such law exists... :D
That is because no one has claimed that it is illegal to learn opposition research from a foreign source!
If a Chinese news outlet reports Trump is really a puppet being controlled by five pot bellied pigs, then we are learning this info from a foreign source. We don’t outlaw learning.
It is illegal to request a foreign government to assist your campaign in any way, however.
How pathetic that you keep having to resort to lying about what others are saying to be right...and you still end up getting it WRONG!
Pompeo misses deadline to turn over State Dept. docs on Ukraine, Giuliani in impeachment inquiry
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-impeachment-inquiry-pompeo-misses-deadline-state-department-ukraine-giuliani-military-aid-documents-subpoena
In other words, Pompeo told Democrats to go frak themselves.. :D
Bring forth the so-called "whistle blower" for questioning and cross examination....
THEN we can discuss Dumbocrat subpoenas...
Not before...
Schiff’s false claim his committee had not spoken to the whistleblower
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/10/04/schiffs-false-claim-his-committee-had-not-spoken-whistleblower/
Funny how no one wants to talk about Schiff-head's lies and bullshit?? Surely at least a MDDOTW dishonorable MENTION!!?????
Why is that??
Oh.. yea, that's right.. Because lying and bullshitting are PERFECTLY acceptable with ya'all if it's the DEMOCRATS who are lying...
Double Standards much???
:eyeroll:
Sections
Democracy Dies in Darkness
Fact Checker Analysis
Schiff’s false claim his committee had not spoken to the whistleblower
Rep. Adam B. Schiff (D-Calif.), chairman of the House Intelligence Committee. (J. Scott Applewhite/AP)
By Glenn Kessler
October 4 at 3:00 AM
“We have not spoken directly with the whistleblower. We would like to.”
— Rep. Adam B. Schiff (D-Calif.), in an interview with MSNBC’s “Morning Joe,” Sept. 17
We recently took Secretary of State Mike Pompeo to task for misleading reporters about the fact that he was a participant in the call between President Trump and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky that was the subject of a whistleblower complaint and now an impeachment inquiry in Congress. He earned Four Pinocchios for being disingenuous in his remarks to reporters to obscure his firsthand knowledge of what took place.
But politicians spin all across Washington, often to deflect uncomfortable facts. Now let’s look at comments by Schiff, who is heading the impeachment inquiry, as reporters probed about the whistleblower before the details of the allegation were revealed.
Schiff’s answers are especially interesting in the wake of reports in the New York Times and The Washington Post that the whistleblower approached a House Intelligence Committee staff member for guidance before filing a complaint with the Intelligence Community inspector general. The staff member learned the “very bare contours” of the allegation that Trump has abused the powers of his office, The Post said.
When the Fact Checker asked what “bare contours” meant, a committee spokesman pointed to an exchange of letters. In a Sept. 13 letter to the committee, the general counsel of the director of national intelligence said that “complaint involves confidential and potentially privileged communications by persons outside the Intelligence Community.” In his own letter that day, Schiff wrote that because of that language, and because the DNI refused to affirm or deny that White House officials were involved in the decision not to forward the complaint, the committee can conclude only that “the serious misconduct involves the president of the United States and/or other senior White House or administration officials.”
Our suspicion is that the unidentified staff member learned the potential complaint involved “privileged” communication, which is code for something having to do with the president.
So, with this new information, let’s look back at how Schiff handled questions about his knowledge of the whistleblower complaint.
The Facts
Sept. 16, interview with Anderson Cooper on CNN
Cooper: “Just to be clear, you don’t know who this alleged whistleblower is or what they are alleging?”
Schiff: “I don’t know the identity of the whistleblower.”
Cooper: “And they haven’t contacted you or their legal representation hasn’t contacted you?”
Schiff: “I don’t want to get into any particulars. I want to make sure that there’s nothing that I do that jeopardizes the whistleblower in any way.”
This is a classic dodge — “don’t want to get into any particulars” — and Cooper failed to follow up. Notice how Schiff quickly answered whether he knew the identity of the whistleblower — “I don’t know” — but then sidestepped the questions about whether the committee had been contacted. But in doing so, he managed not to mislead; he just simply did not answer the question.
Sept. 17, interview on “Morning Joe”
Sam Stein: “Have you heard from the whistleblower? Do you want to hear from the whistleblower? What protections could you provide to the whistleblower?” …
Schiff: “We have not spoken directly with the whistleblower. We would like to. But I am sure the whistleblower has concerns that he has not been advised, as the law requires, by the inspector general or the director of national Intelligence just how he is supposed to communicate with Congress, and so the risk to the whistleblower is retaliation.”
This is flat-out false. Unlike the quick two-step dance he performed with Anderson Cooper, Schiff simply says the committee had not spoken to the whistleblower. Now we know that’s not true.
“Regarding Chairman Schiff’s comments on ‘Morning Joe,’ in the context, he intended to answer the question of whether the Committee had heard testimony from the whistleblower, which they had not,” a committee spokesman told The Fact Checker. “As he said in his answer, the whistleblower was then awaiting instructions from the Acting DNI as to how the whistleblower could contact the Committee. Nonetheless he acknowledges that his statement should have been more carefully phrased to make that distinction clear.”
The spokesman pointed to an interview with Schiff by the Daily Beast, in which he said that he “did not know definitively at the time if the complaint had been authored by the same whistleblower who had approached his staff.” But he added that he “should have been much more clear.”
Sept. 19, meeting with reporters at the Capitol
Schiff: “In the absence of the actions, and I want to thank the inspector general, in the absence of his actions in coming to our committee, we might not have even known there was a whistleblower complaint alleging an urgent concern.”
Here’s some more dissembling. Schiff says that if not for the IG, the committee might never have known about the complaint. But his committee knew that something explosive was going to be filed with the IG. As the New York Times put it, the initial inquiry received by the committee “also explains how Mr. Schiff knew to press for the complaint when the Trump administration initially blocked lawmakers from seeing it.”
Schiff, however, does qualify that this was a complaint alleging “an urgent concern,” and it’s not clear whether the initial inquiry had tipped off the committee staff that it would rise to that level. Still, Schiff’s phrasing was misleading because he gives no hint that the committee was aware a potentially significant (“privileged”) complaint might have been filed.
“As Chairman Schiff has made clear, he does not know the identity of the whistleblower, has had no communication with them or their attorney, and did not view the whistleblower’s complaint until the day prior to the hearing with the DNI when the ODNI finally provided it to the Committee,” the spokesman said. “Whistleblowers frequently come to the committee. Some whistleblowers approach the IG without notice to the Committee, and some who do go to the IG do not necessarily file a complaint. However, this was the first whistleblower complaint provided to the Committee this year that the IC IG determined to be of ‘urgent concern’ and ‘credible,’ and Chairman Schiff would have raised the alarm regardless when it was illegally withheld.”
The spokesman added: “The focus should not be on the whistleblower, but rather the complaint which the IC IG determined was credible and urgent and which has been thus far confirmed by the call record released by the White House and statements by the President and his personal attorney.”
The Pinocchio Test
There are right ways and wrong ways to answer reporters’ questions if a politician wants to maintain his or her credibility. There’s nothing wrong with dodging a question, as long as you don’t try to mislead (as Pompeo did).
But Schiff on “Morning Joe” clearly made a statement that was false. He now says he was answering the wrong question, but if that was the case, he should have quickly corrected the record. He compounded his falsehood by telling reporters a few days later that if not for the IG’s office, the committee would not have known about the complaint. That again suggested there had been no prior communication.
The explanation that Schiff was not sure it was the same whistleblower especially strains credulity.
Schiff earns Four Pinocchios.
And the condemnation from the Trump/America haters???
{{{cccchhhhhhhhhhhiiiiiirrrrrpppppppp}}}
Yea... Figures...
It's a sad day in Weigantia that a Democrat flat out LIES, even by the LEFT's weird standards of what is a "lie"...
A Democrat flat out LIES.... And it's not even worth a dis-honorable mention in the MDDOTW section.. :(
Awww crap!!
I didn't mean to CnP the ENTIRE commentary.. Just the last paragraph..
My bust, CW.. I know you hate that.. It wasn't intentional...
Interesting..
No conceal carry permit needed if Florida bill passes
https://www.fox35orlando.com/news/no-conceal-carry-permit-needed-if-florida-bill-passes?fbclid=IwAR2t0LcKuHMVWJ3eS2uVN_PQWoTY2fayXQJvsOHAS9ESR4drkzmUdtr6q3E
Florida may become a Constitutional Carry state....
In May, Joe Biden's lead over Dem field nationally was 26.8 points. Today it's 2.2 points. He's no longer the frontrunner. It's not the same race we've been talking about for months.
-Byron York
Anyone who thinks that Biden is going to be the nominee really needs to take a look around at reality...
And, considering that Joe Biden's worst days are AHEAD of him, there is plenty of room to fall...
Romney blasts Trump over 'wrong and appalling' call for China to probe Bidens
Romney and Nebraska Sen. Ben Sasse are the first sitting Republican senators to publicly condemn Trump's remarks.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/trump-impeachment-inquiry/romney-blasts-trump-wrong-appalling-call-china-probe-bidens-n1062536
Since Romney is a two time presidential luser, one has to wonder why ANYONE would give his opinions any credence...
It would like paying attention to Hillary Clinton..
What moron would do THAT!??
Adam Schiff’s rocky impeachment launch fuels GOP pushback
Pelosi, in late September, turned to Schiff to take over the Trump investigation after the House Judiciary Committee, headed by Rep. Jerrold Nadler of New York, botched the effort.
Nadler had declared last summer that he was conducting his own impeachment proceedings and did so without receiving Pelosi's blessing to label it as such.
Nadler expanded his investigation again and again to include a multitude of allegations against Trump, including whether he paid hush money to an adult film star and Playboy model when he was running for president. Nadler's hearings featured combative witnesses and theatrics from lawmakers and were largely criticized by both parties.
Pelosi chose Schiff in part to bring integrity and credibility to a much narrower impeachment inquiry than Nadler was conducting.
But Schiff may have stumbled out of the gate.
Many believe Schiff bungled his inaugural impeachment hearing when he read aloud his fictitious account of the July 25 phone call between Trump and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/congress/adam-schiffs-rocky-impeachment-launch-fuels-gop-pushback
Schiff-head is giving the President all the President needs in order to expose this faux impeachment as the coup that it is..
https://twitter.com/i/status/1180245134363025415
Yep.. Schiff-head lies with impunity and not a single Weigantian says "boo" about it...
I mean, I thought ya'all were AGAINST lies??
Apparently, you are only against lies when the guy with the -R after his name does it.. :eyeroll:
Suddenlyreflective
1
Your post makes a lot of great points.
And yet -- Donald Trump decides that he's going to ask for election interference from everyone besides his own government.
Barr, Pompeo, Pence, Mulvaney, etc. are part of our/"his" own government... so, of course, Trump has asked for election interference from the American people's government as well as from our allies, and as if that wasn't heinous enough, Donald Trump has enlisted help from the dictator of a communist nation in order to subvert our democratic elections.
Bottom line: Trump is using the people's government and taxpayers' dollars in order to shakedown our allies and our adversaries to advance a false narrative straight off the pages at 4Chan... an agenda that serves not only his own personal ends but also those of Vladimir Putin, whose fingerprints are all over this -- impeachable offenses commonly referred to as abuse of power of the office of the presidency in order to effect an election and the subsequent coverup of same, and anyone (not directed at you personally) who buys into the utter nonsensical BS that these aren't impeachable offenses as well as illegal offenses needs to crack a book and revisit the history surrounding the Watergate era where a multitude of people not named Nixon served jail time for their crimes while Nixon resigned the office of the presidency in disgrace.
History sometimes rhymes, and we are living during one of those times... right down to the involvement of one Roger Stone.
Paula
2
Great post. :)
And it's in Dem's interest to make that very, very clear as this unfolds because THAT is what may motivate Repubs to work behind the scenes to get Blotus to resign. That's the way out for the GOP.
That is definitely the way out for the GOP, but Trump will take every single one of the GOP down before he resigns because that's just the way he rolls. It's not bloody likely Trump will resign, though, because there is no way out for Poor Donald regardless because -- sing it with me:
New York, New York! :)
People who think her making public appearances hurts Dems ARE THE PEOPLE DOING THE HURTING.
There are a lot of people who really, really hate Hillary Clinton. There's no real reason for it, but they do. When she makes headlines, it riles those people up, and it reinforces their negative associations with the Democratic party. Yet somehow it's people who notice this, and have no influence whatsoever on anyone, who are to blame? This thesis makes no sense.
If Hillary speaks to friendly audiences in venues that don't make news, that helps. But she should stay out of the spotlight.
Most shocking head-line of the century - "Trump looking for help from any source whatsoever to uncover political 'dirt' on his opponent!!!"
Aren't ALL POLiTICIANS eager and willing to find political "dirt" on their opponent(s), from any source whatsoever???
Does the bear shit in the forest???
Is water wet???
These are all serious questions that need to be subjected to intense scientific enquiry!
Re [52]: May is not a relevant baseline. Polling then measured nothing but pre-existing name recognition. Joe Biden is the nominee. Attacks from Republicans will just make Democratic primary voters rally 'round their standard bearer.
His worst days are indeed ahead. But they won't come until the Senate tries him, after he gets enough delegates for the nomination.
CRS,
Most shocking head-line of the century - "Trump looking for help from any source whatsoever to uncover political 'dirt' on his opponent!!!"
Aren't ALL POLiTICIANS eager and willing to find political "dirt" on their opponent(s), from any source whatsoever???
Why yes.. Yes they are..
But, apparently, with THIS crowd, it's only "Illegal" when a guy with an -R after his name does it..
DSWS,
Re [52]: May is not a relevant baseline.
Unless it's whose who want to look at polls that say Trump is going to lose.. Then it's a perfectly apt baseline.. :D
His worst days are indeed ahead.
Thank you.. :D
JL
8
By the way cw, i vote Hillary Clinton as most disappointing. She showed up in the media again this week, spurring suggestions that she may be a late entry into the 2020 primary.
Hillary has made it abundantly clear that she's not running for the presidency in 2020. However, there are always going to be right-wingnut gaslighters and inveterate morons and fools who howl at the moon that "Hillary is running" every time she expresses an opinion whether she's on live television or just on the record with a journalist. That's all part and parcel of keeping the gullible wingnuts herded and whining in unison like bleating sheeple.
I think Hillary would have made a good president had she won, but her time is done now.
Her time is done now?
Contrast that sentiment with the repeated wingnut calls that "Barack Hussein Obama" should be front and center pronto and defending Joe Biden and the fact that he isn't proves he's guilty. Utter nonsense. The fact is that the right wingnut propaganda machine would just use that occasion to beat Joe Biden over the head and unite their sheeple in their hatred of all things Obama.
So to recap: No one should remove themselves from public view for fear that the right wingnut propaganda machine will use their existence as a tool to galvanize the useful idiots united in their hatred of the "others"... they'll be doing that regardless.
Paula
11
HRC didn't spur the idea that she'd run again except among idiots.
Exactly right, and I know what you meant even though it sounds harsh.
The GOP will use any arrow in their quiver that riles up the bleating sheeple that are united in their hatred of all things "Hillary" and "Hussein Obama." It's what they repeated do, and no one should be forced into exile over the right-wing ridiculous propaganda spewage.
No one should remove themselves from public view for fear that the right wingnut propaganda machine will use their existence as a tool to galvanize the useful idiots united in their hatred of the "others"... they'll be doing that regardless.
amen to that
For the record, Hillary has NEVER given a Sherman when asked if she would run again in 2020...
She has always given herself a deniable out...
When she Sherman's the question, then she can be completely counted out..
She hasn't done so to date..
[64 - 65]: Yep to both!
For the record, Hillary has NEVER given a Sherman when asked if she would run again in 2020...She has always given herself a deniable out.
And of course, no one said that she can't have fun watching Right wing heads explode every time that she books an appearance.
Russ
22
It is telling that both Ukraine and China, two countries known internationally for their corruption, have publicly stated that they are not interested in being involved in Trump’s corruption of our elections.
Yes, sir, and it should be lost on no one that Manafort's current permanent place of residence is a jail cell due to a combination of Manafort being found guilty at trial and his pleading guilty to every single criminal charge against him stemming from the Mueller investigation, most of which criminal charges are related to income Manafort earned working as a political consultant for Ukraine's former president, Viktor Yanukovych, who was backed by Russia. Fast forward when Yanukovich lost power in Ukraine and was run out of the country and into Russia.
So to recap: Manafort pleaded guilty to multiple crimes including his defrauding of the United States and financial institutions after his Russian-backed client Yanukovich lost power in Ukraine and dried up Manafort’s consulting operation there.
Fast forward to now where Donald Trump is attempting to use our allies and a communist adversary to rewrite the Mueller report implicating Russia, Manafort, Stone, and multiple other as yet unnamed cases that continue robustly as outlined in Appendix D (heavily redacted).
Dot. Dot. Dot. Dot. Dot. <--- Connect.
And of course, no one said that she can't have fun watching Right wing heads explode every time that she books an appearance.
Face reality, sunshine..
More people have Liz's and the Right Wingers opinion of Hillary than has your opinion that she is god's gifts to Democrats..
But I noticed how you totally ignored my point.. Which tells everyone you agree that Hillary COULD run again in 2020..
I accept your concession..
TS
41
Heh!
Mike
44
And another week has passed and STILL Democrats are afraid to produce the alleged "whistle blower" and her witnesses..
Her witnesses? Oh, you are so woefully misinformed to the point of hilarity.
Sen. Marsha Blackburn: Dems' impeachment gambit is a revenge scheme orchestrated by a fallen political party
https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/marsha-blackburn-democrats-impeachment-revenge-scheme
That sums things up perfectly...
Another day, another scandal that’s sure to trigger the Trump administration’s downfall—if only the American people would be less picky about what the definition of the word “evidence” is.
The Ukraine Call Transcript. The Whistleblower Complaint. The Impeachment Inquiry. The pieces of this latest impeachment jigsaw have reached mythic status, bolstered by frenzied reporting, and insistence on the part of Democrats and advocates that this time, they’ve got the president right where they want him.
In reality, the documents offer very little in the form of an obvious smoking gun. Both the transcript and the complaint have become a cultural Rorschach test: no matter the evidence (or lack thereof) the reader will see exactly what they want to see.
Yep.. Exactly..
There is not a single solitary fact that supports impeachment...
You people are simply channeling Goebbels and hoping that a lie worshiped enough will become factual...
Ain't never gonna happen..
Even before we saw the transcript of President Trump’s July 25 call with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky, Democrats and their friends in the media were already imploring the American people to accept as fact that the president had betrayed the nation’s trust by asking for foreign help in undermining the 2020 elections.
After the White House released the declassified transcript, the game changed.
Realizing there was no illicit request—and thus, no grounds for impeachment—leftists quickly turned their focus toward the intelligence community’s “whistleblower.”
It should have been an easy win. The anonymous employee’s detailed complaint suggested that the contents of the transcript had triggered alarm within the intelligence community.
Unfortunately for the coup plotters, it was revealed that Schiff-head was lying thru his teeth..
The "whistle blower" is nothing but a Democrat plant who was coached by Democrats and whose complaint was authored by someone who had an eye, not on a legal-justifying document, but rather an eye on a Democrat media press release..
I'll be surprised if Pelosi doesn't shut this coup down sooner rather than later..
Before it does some REAL damage to the Dumbocrat Party..
If you can’t impeach for the crime, goes their argument, impeach for the cover-up!
What will happen, you ask, when this new revelation inevitably fizzles out? Democrats and their friends in the media will haul the goalposts down to the other end of the field, and continue their attempts to undermine the American public’s faith in the president they chose.
In 2016, before Trump took the oath of office, Senate Democrats hatched a legislative plot to transform the president’s alleged conflicts of interest into “high crimes” that would damn Trump’s presidency to be one of the shortest in history.
Their efforts failed.
House Democrats tried to impeach in 2017, and again in 2018, and failed both times.
Democrats.. The FAILURE PARTY
:D
May not have a ring to it, but it has the advantage of being factually accurate..
Which is more than all of ya'all can say about ya'all's spewings.. :D
This year, Democrats failed to impeach, tried and failed to extract one last death rattle from the remains of the Mueller Report, and are now shopping the preposterous notion that this (!) iteration of the malfeasance narrative is based on the lowest-hanging fruit of all. They’ve placed their hopes in the pages of a neatly-packaged whistleblower complaint that reads more like an advocate’s legal brief than an objective statement of “urgent concern.”
Fortunately, the American People have grown wearily accustomed to looking past the fakery and seeing these world-ending controversies for what they truly are: breathless revenge schemes orchestrated by a fallen political party.
Just when ya think Democrats couldn't step on their dicks anymore... The come out and surprise every one at the depth of depravity they inflict on this great country..
Testimony From Ukraine Envoy Kurt Volker Directly Contradicts Democrats’ Impeachment Narrative
Testimony from Ukraine envoy Kurt Volker, which was obtained by The Federalist, blows holes directly through the impeachment narrative that congressional Democrats have crafted against President Donald Trump.
https://thefederalist.com/2019/10/04/testimony-from-ukraine-envoy-kurt-volker-directly-contradicts-democrats-impeachment-narrative/
No matter WHERE Democrats turn, their bullshit story is falling apart....
Mike
66
For the record, Hillary has NEVER given a Sherman when asked if she would run again in 2020...
For the record, you are the single largest source of misinformation and ignorance that posts on this forum. Anyone with their head not planted firmly up their ass knows that she's not running:
* She hasn't filed the mandatory myriad of forms at the federal level and a myriad of states.
* She hasn't participated in any debates to date.
* She's not collecting any donations for a campaign she's not running.
* She announced she's not running.
She has always given herself a deniable out...
You have never given your firmly planted head a way out of your ass. :)
The whole point of a whistleblower statute is that someone will not be made public, to avoid being targeted for revenge. Given that accusations of espionage and the threat of violence have already been made by the president, it seems more prudent than ever to keep the accuser's identity temporarily concealed.
I'm not saying Hillary should go crawl under a rock or anything. It's just a particularly bad time politically for her to be making a book tour.
And think: the whistleblower received no raise in pay to be a whistleblower. But he's now secretly, a world celebrity. Seriously. Everyone wants to know who he is. And the very second that the wrong person finds that out, he's got a target on his back.
Well, I'd see that movie.
Congressional testimony from the former top American envoy to Ukraine directly contradicts the impeachment narrative offered by congressional Democrats and their media allies. Ambassador Kurt Volker, who served for two years as the top U.S. diplomatic envoy to Ukraine, testified on Thursday that he was never aware of and never took part in any effort to push the Ukrainian government to investigate former Vice President Joe Biden or his son Hunter. He also stressed that the interactions between Giuliani and Ukrainian officials were facilitated not to find dirt on Biden, but to assuage concerns that the incoming Ukrainian government would not be able to get a handle on corruption within the country.
Volker’s full remarks, which were obtained by The Federalist, can be read here.
“As you will see from the extensive text messages I am providing, which convey a sense of real-time dialogue with several different actors, Vice President Biden was never a topic of discussion” during negotiations with Ukraine, Volker testified. Cherry-picked snippets of those texts were released by the office of Rep. Adam Schiff, D-Calif., late Thursday evening.
“[A]t no time was I aware of or took part in an effort to urge Ukraine to investigate former Vice President Biden,” Volker told lawmakers.
Kinda kills the Democrats entire claim.. :D
The facts always do...
And think: the whistleblower received no raise in pay to be a whistleblower. But he's now secretly, a world celebrity. Seriously. Everyone wants to know who he is. And the very second that the wrong person finds that out, he's got a target on his back.
YOu should write fiction..
Och, what am I saying.. You DO write fiction..
You have NO FACTS to support your claims..
You have NO FACTS to support the whistle blower claims..
What are Democrats afraid of that they won't allow the whistle blower to be questioned??
What are YOU afraid of??
I can answer that one.. Yer afraid that the entire faux impeachment will be exposed for the con and the coup that it is..
The whole point of a whistleblower statute is that someone will not be made public, to avoid being targeted for revenge. Given that accusations of espionage and the threat of violence have already been made by the president, it seems more prudent than ever to keep the accuser's identity temporarily concealed.
Except for the FACT that there is no facts to support the whistle blowers claim..
You are basing your persecution of President Trump SOLELY on hearsay and third person hearsay at that.
And you don't see the LEAST bit of problem with that, eh??
And then, of course, you have a FIRST PERSON confession from Joe Biden about HIS extortion and HIS quid pro quo..
But you don't believe that at all..
Do you see how utterly off the reservation you are???
I'm not saying Hillary should go crawl under a rock or anything. It's just a particularly bad time politically for her to be making a book tour.
Au contraire... It's a PERFECT time for a Hillary book tour...
It simply proves that Hillary is out for Hillary and no one else..
You are basing your persecution of President Trump SOLELY on hearsay and third person hearsay at that.
And you don't see the LEAST bit of problem with that, eh??
And then, of course, you have a FIRST PERSON confession from Joe Biden about HIS extortion and HIS quid pro quo..
But you don't believe that at all..
Do you see how utterly off the reservation you are???
The Weigantia of a decade ago would NEVER have supported the kinds of bullshit that HHPTDS demands today...
NEVER....
As long as Democrats are afraid to let the "whistle blower" be questioned and cross-examined, their entire "impeachment" is bullshit..
Even CW agrees with that...
He said it himself, that the hearsay and third person and hidden witnesses is FINE at "the beginning" of the investigation...
But ONLY at the beginning..
If Dumbocrats try to go on a witch hunt or fishing expedition W/O substantiated FACTS, they are going to be bitch slapped to hell..
Anyone who thinks that hearsay and third person narratives are perfectly acceptable to prosecute on??
Is a MORON or a Party slave..
It's THAT simple...
We need to talk about Hunter Biden
The growing scandal around Ukraine shows a Biden nomination would be a big gamble – one Democrats would be foolish to make
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/oct/05/we-need-to-talk-about-hunter-biden
Don't bitch at me..
These are DEMOCRATS who are saying this..
Yea, I am looking at you, Blathy....
JL
81
I hear you.
But I think it's high time in history that no Democrat alive should hide in fear of how the Right Wingnutosphere is going to react. Screw that! Let the spineless Republicans hide in the exact same manner they're now already doing.
Democrats have spent far too long apologizing and overanalyzing the optics of how they should react to the current PT Three Ring Circus. Democrats need to forget about the damn optics and politics and get busy doing their jobs to protect the rule of law and our democracy because at this point, Trump has left them no choice. :)
Balthasar
82
And think: the whistleblower received no raise in pay to be a whistleblower. But he's now secretly, a world celebrity. Seriously. Everyone wants to know who he is. And the very second that the wrong person finds that out, he's got a target on his back.
He's CIA, and he might be joined by yet another higher up whistleblower IC official whom the Trump-appointed ICIG questioned in order to validate the original whistleblower's complaint.
Well, I'd see that movie.
Oh, yes, sir... count me in. In fact, I'm hoping for that double feature:
* Whistleblower Won
* Whistleblower Too
:)
In an Aug. 10 text message, Volker tells Yermak that once the statement is ironed out, they can then “use that” to get the date for the meeting between Trump and Zelensky.
Yermak’s response makes the bargain clear. “Once we have a date, will call for a press briefing, announcing upcoming visit and outlining vision for the reboot of US-UKRAINE relationship, including among other things Burisma and election meddling in investigations,” he writes.
“Sounds great!” Volker replies.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/holding-ukraine-hostage-how-the-president-and-his-allies-chasing-2020-ammunition-fanned-a-political-storm/2019/10/04/100e9868-e6a5-11e9-a331-2df12d56a80b_story.html
WaPoop??
Enough said....
They have to print so many retractions, they should be classified as a fiction outlet...
The standard lines from Democrats about Hunter Biden and his business dealings in China and Ukraine have been consistent: Donald Trump has abused the office of the president by asking foreign leaders to investigate Biden’s son, and there is absolutely no proof that either Joe or Hunter Biden have done anything to break the law. Any questionable dealings by Biden’s son also pale in comparison to ethical breaches on the part of Ivanka, Eric or Donald Trump Jr, who have routinely blurred the lines between the extended Trump Organization – the family’s business empire –and their presence in the White House.
This is all true, and arguably these are the right lines vis-a-vis the long overdue impeachment proceedings. What’s harder to shake is the fact that Hunter Biden’s career is undeniably shady in the way that only the son of a longtime Washington insider could muster, failing upwards into positions of influence and power on the merits of his last name. And that should be considered a huge liability to Joe Biden, for months now considered heir apparent for the Democratic party’s presidential nomination.
Biden will NOT be the nominee..
It's really THAT simple...
From the above article:
On Sept. 1, Taylor raised his concerns again. “Are we now saying that security assistance and WH meeting are conditioned on investigations?” That same day, at a meeting in Warsaw, the Ukrainians were hearing the same message from Vice President Pence when he told Zelensky that the United States was still concerned that Ukraine was not doing enough on corruption.
Sondland refused to engage Taylor on the matter by text, telling him to “Call me.”
A week later, on Sept. 8, Taylor issued a more forceful warning, saying that he would not be part of coercing a public pledge from Zelensky and withholding aid that Ukraine desperately needed. “The nightmare is they give the interview and don’t get the security assistance,” he said. If that were to unfold, he said, “The Russians love it. (And I quit.)”
One day later, on Sept. 9, Taylor confronted Sondland one last time by text, saying, “I think it’s crazy to withhold security assistance for help with a political campaign.”
Russ
92
Yes. Quid pro quo not required, Russ, but the evidence presented to date actually shows that the Trump administration was offering "something for something":
Something
* First, a phone call between Trump and Zelensky
* Second, a visit to the White House for Zelensky
* Finally, release of military aid to Ukraine
for
Something
* Ukraine's public announcement of investigation into Biden
* Ukraine's investigation of Biden
* Ukraine's production of dirt on Biden
And that's just the evidence so far. :)
WaPoop??
Enough said....
They have to print so many retractions, they should be classified as a fiction outlet...
Says the troll posting from The Federalist website... which never prints retractions — when you are knowingly and intentionally lying to your readers, there is never a need for retractions!
It’s funny that you are back on attacking the websites of articles reporting info that you cannot defend against...at the same time you are posting from unknown sites that look like the final projects for a class in Propaganda 101!
Kick,
I got the feeling reading a lot of Volker’s statements that he might have been telling Pres. Z that he didn’t actually have to investigate anything, he simply had to say the lines Trump needed to hear him say to satisfy the voices in Trump’s head.
It still looks real bad for everyone involved, but in this presidency it seems like the best option to avoid Trump’s mood swings from completely destroying our relationships with our allies.
And think: the whistleblower received no raise in pay to be a whistleblower. But he's now secretly, a world celebrity. Seriously. Everyone wants to know who he is. And the very second that the wrong person finds that out, he's got a target on his back.
Well, I'd see that movie.
I would guess that this individual is working on lining up a new secure place for he and his loved ones to be able to move to at a moment’s notice!
His world is about to be completely turned upside down and ripped to shreds in the hope of finding anything that can be used to tarnish his noble actions: getting everyone in his family new cellphones and unlisted numbers, setting up new email and social media accounts, arranging security details for his family.
If someone has not created a business that assists instant media stars on how to survive losing their normal way of life, it would probably be a highly rewarding, as well as a profitable career!
Since Romney is a two time presidential luser, one has to wonder why ANYONE would give his opinions any credence...
It would like paying attention to Hillary Clinton..
What moron would do THAT!??
The only way a person could be a BIGGER moron would be to think that someone who has driven their businesses into bankruptcy six times is a great businessman!
JL,
OK... Here we go..
By way of analogy, I am going to explain my position and your position on this whole whistle blower/faux impeachment mess..
The DA of your city hates you.. Hates you and your entire family.. Hates you and all your friends and acquaintances..
The DA announces that he has an anonymous complaint that says you, JL have downloaded adult porn... Mind you, the DA doesn't have the actual PERSON... All he has is that the person filed a complaint anonymously.. The DA further states that the anonymous complaint says that they heard from a friend of your cousins that some of the porn you have was illegally downloaded.
The DA announces that he is opening a death penalty care against you and that his ONLY basis is this anonymous 3rd person hearsay complaint.
The DA uses this complaint as a pretext to crawl up YOUR ass and all over your life with a fine tooth comb.. The DA further uses this excuse to crawl up all your friends' and families' asses..
"Wait!!???" you ask... "Where is this person IN PERSON!!!??? You can't prosecute a DEATH PENALTY CASE based on 3rd person hearsay!!! I have a right to face my accuser!!!"
"Sorry" The DA replies.. This anonymous complainer is scared of your retaliation so we have allowed him to remain completely anonymous through out our fine tooth up your ass phase..."
After a week of this, it is reported that the DA **LIED** when he claimed he has had no contact with this anonymous "whistle blower".. In fact, you learn that not only did the DA have CONTACT with this "whistle blower" A WHOLE MONTH BEFORE HAND, the verbiage and the formatting of the complain indicates it was actually WRITTEN by this DA that hates you so much...
THAT is a perfect analogy to what is happening with President Trump and the Democrats..
Now, YOUR response to this complete abdication of proper jurisprudence is "Well, everyone hates me so I guess it's acceptable"
MY response to this is "ARE YOU FRAKIN' KIDDING ME!!!!! HELL, THE NAZIS WEREN'T EVEN THIS FASCIST!!!!"
And, before you question the proper analogy of this being a Death Penalty case against you...
"Impeachment is the legal form of assassination"
-Jerrold Nadler quoting Benjamin Franklin
Now.. Take a step back and tell me how utterly WHACKED your position is...
I'll be around for a few more minutes...
The vast majority of Democrats are on record as saying that impeachment should NEVER be done in a partisan manner...
GOP unlikely to reprise role it played in Nixon’s 1974 exit
https://apnews.com/ff1504ddaa5446e5903d4e883e79ff51
Let's hear from Democrats if they still feel that way...
And let's not forget what JOE BIDEN said..
"The President Of The United States should be given EVERY benefit of the doubt.."
Who here would bitch slap Biden if he said something like that now???
The only way a person could be a BIGGER moron would be to think that someone who has driven their businesses into bankruptcy six times is a great businessman!
And only the BIGGEST MORON on the PLANET would think that 500 successful business with only six bankruptcies is the mark of a bad businessman..
Face the facts, cockholster..
You are WAY out of your league...
Better gather up your legion of Doom.. Yer gonna need the back-up...
After initially denying any wrongdoing, Trump then confessed to what the whistleblower reported and further stated he'd do it again. Then Trump did it again with cameras rolling.
Trump has a definite pattern that starts with denial and ends with confession and a promise to do it again.
He worked with Russia via their cutout WikiLeaks to interfere in our democratic elections, and now he's doing it again.
Case closed. :)
The ‘Never Trump’ Coalition That Decided Eh, Nevermind, He’s Fine
WASHINGTON — In 2016, Erick Erickson could not have been clearer. Donald Trump was “a racist” and “a fascist.” It was no wonder, Mr. Erickson wrote, that “so many people with swastikas in their Twitter profile pics” supported him. “I will not vote for Donald Trump. Ever,” he insisted, adding his voice to the chorus of Never Trump Republicans.
L. Brent Bozell III sitting on a bench: L. Brent Bozell III, the founder of the Media Research Center, once wrote that “Trump might be the greatest charlatan of them all.” He now counts himself as a convert of the president’s.© William Widmer for The New York Times L. Brent Bozell III, the founder of the Media Research Center, once wrote that “Trump might be the greatest charlatan of them all.” He now counts himself as a convert of the president’s.
Last week, Mr. Erickson, a well-known conservative blogger, titled one of his pieces “I Support the President.” In three years, he had come completely around, a transformation that is a testament to President Trump’s remarkable consolidation of support inside the Republican Party. The effort to impeach the president, Mr. Erickson wrote, was a desperate move by people “who have never come to terms with him.”
“Never Trump” no more, conservatives have largely resigned themselves to a more accommodating state of mind: “Never mind Trump.” And their change in attitude helps to mute the much smaller group of conservative voices who remain highly critical of the president and have questioned his conduct.
Glenn Beck, the radio host who once called Mr. Trump “an immoral man who is absent decency or dignity,” now says that his defeat in 2020 would mark “the end of the country as we know it.” Senator Lindsey Graham of South Carolina, who so bitterly feuded with the president during the 2016 primaries that Mr. Trump gave out Mr. Graham’s cellphone number on national television, declared last week that impeachment was nothing but “a political set up.”
It can be difficult to remember that indignation and contempt for Mr. Trump once simmered in every corner of the conservative world. In August 2016, dozens of the most senior Republican national security officials signed a letter warning he would “put at risk our country’s national security and well-being.”
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/the-never-trump-coalition-that-decided-eh-nevermind-hes-fine/ar-AAIjNMw
Sorry, Dumbocrats.. There won't be any bipartisan/GOP cover for your faux impeachment coup..
You Dumbocrats are going to OWN it..
And things will be 20x worse for ya'all than it was for the GOP after the Clinton impeachment..
"Given the essentially anti-democratic nature of impeachment and the great dangers inherent in the too-ready exercise of that power, impeachment has no place in our system of constitutional democracy except as an extreme measure – reserved for breaches of the public trust by a president who so violates his official duties, misuses his official powers or places our system of government at such risk that our constitutional government is put in immediate danger by his continuing to serve out the term to which the people of the United States elected him"
-Joe Biden
Hypocrisy.... Thy name is DEMOCRAT
And things will be 20x worse for ya'all than it was for the GOP after the Clinton impeachment..
Republicans won the White House in the subsequent election after Clinton's impeachment. I would wager that Democrats would be okay with that "worse" outcome. :)
"I am here today to call for bipartisanship in the impeachment process. It is a concept many will say they agree with. But actions speak louder than words."
-Joe Biden
"The president’s accusers must go beyond hearsay and innuendo and beyond demands that the president prove his innocence of vague and changing charges. They must provide clear and convincing evidence of specific impeachable conduct."
-Joe Biden
Well, Democrats have already FAILED the Biden stricture..
Amazing ya'all don't even care...
HHPTDS indeed...
Amazing ya'all don't even care...
Yeah, amazing isn't it, that you can run a guy that the other party simply detests, who shreds every democratic accomplishment that he can from the government, who particularly goes after all of the Obama-era laws and regulations, and who completely turns his own party upside-down, and the opposition wants him out of office. Who knew, eh?
How can Senate Republicans save themselves from being destroyed as a party and the harsh judgement history will condemn them to thanks to Trump’s legacy?
By unanimously voting to remove him from office during the impeachment trial! Standing together as one legislative body with Democrats will make it difficult for all but the most extreme fringes to not see that as a clear indication that Trump HAD TO GO!
I know this sounds crazy, but honestly it may the only hope Republicans have to minimize the damage that their cowardliness has earned them. They will pay dearly for selling their souls to Trump and allowing his corruption to spread unchecked throughout our government.
Many have left office already as they saw the writing on the walls and were smart enough to get out while they could — hoping to distance themselves from Trump as much as possible if they are to have any chance at a future in politics again.
The Republicans are well aware of how Trump’s legacy is doomed the moment he is no longer shielded from prosecution by the Office of the President. Their choice to align themselves so closely with his corruption means they will also suffer. But history will remember them much more positively if they stand in defense of our Constitution, even if they waited to the last moment to do so; it’s what our country desperately needs of them right now!
Someone should do an ad campaign called "maybe they were right the first time", showing Never Trump clips from prominent Republicans before they flip-flopped. It should be completely open about the fact that these people have changed their mind, displaying the name of the series as a logo at the start of each ad, after a voice-over saying that they did subsequently flip-flop, but ... .
I'm pretty sure there are a lot of real zingers out there.
THAT is a perfect analogy to what is happening with President Trump and the Democrats..
Yeah, just like Trump’s phone call with Ukraine’s President was PERFECT, right?
You left out some key parts...like that before the DA announces he was investigating you, a police detective had already investigated some of the allegations the whistleblower made against you and found multiple sources that provided evidence supporting those allegations.
When you hear that the DA is going to announce a whistleblower has made allegations against you, but no one knows what it concerns, you decide to take charge of your own fate and provide YOUR account off what you think the DA is going to attack. You feel great about beating the DA to the punch by getting your version of what happened out before the DA can put out lies about you and what you allegedly did.
Then the DA releases the whistleblower’s complaint and you realize that something is very strange....the whistleblower’s allegations are not in conflict with your account of what occurred as you had thought it would. Worse, it is clear that your account is an admission that everything the whistleblower alleges is true!
It doesn’t matter who the whistleblower is. It does not matter how the DA feels about you or your history with them. It would not matter now if the DA had actually made up the whistleblower and just pulled the allegations out of his ass.
You submitted a deposition of what you claim occurred prior to knowing what the whistleblower’s complaint actually contained... that deposition is nothing short of a signed confession to criminal activity by YOU!
This is what has to be so frustrating for you — Had you just kept your mouth shut for once in your life, they might not have had anything on you and if they did, you would have had an opportunity to come up with an account of events that denied the allegations. YOU CONFESSED TO THE CRIMES... GAME OVER!
DSWS,
Someone should do an ad campaign called "maybe they were right the first time", showing Never Trump clips from prominent Republicans before they flip-flopped. It should be completely open about the fact that these people have changed their mind, displaying the name of the series as a logo at the start of each ad, after a voice-over saying that they did subsequently flip-flop, but ... .
I'm pretty sure there are a lot of real zingers out there.
Yunno, it's funny... I was thinking the EXACT same thing when I was posting all the Democrat/Impeachment quotes.. :D
Yer right.. There ARE a lot of zingers there.. :D
Russ,
This is what has to be so frustrating for you
Me?? FRUSTRATED??
BBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
I am having a blast!! :D
I had BEGGED the Democrat Party to impeach President Trump..
And it's going down JUST as I predicted it would!!
It's all blowing up in Democrats' faces.. :D
You think I was gloating after your Russia Collusion delusion was exposed??
Wait until you see how things are when Pelosi is forced to put a kibosh on this whole faux impeachment coup..
You'll be WISHING for the pleasant days in the immediate aftermath of your Russia Collusion delusion.. :D
BIDEN WARNS TRUMP: YOU WON'T DESTROY ME
I have to concede that Joe is 100% factually accurate..
President Trump WON'T destroy Joe Biden..
The Democrats are doing a bang-up job of that all on their own..
Biden counterpunch tries to turn attention to 'wholly unfit' Trump
https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/Biden-counterpunch-tries-to-turn-attention-to-14495561.php
Emphasis on the word *TRIES*...
Joe is flailing and he knows it...
Joe Biden on Saturday sought to take a more aggressive tone in combating President Donald Trump, a shift in strategy amid signs of worry among campaign donors and supporters that his message is getting lost in an onslaught from the White House.
Biden wrote an op-ed that was published Saturday night in The Washington Post, attempting to refocus attention on Trump's impropriety in asking Ukrainian leaders to investigate Biden's family.
Joe Biden is worried...
Joe Biden's campaign is worried..
The onslaught from friend and foe alike is taking it's toll on the Biden campaign..
Where is Obama??? Where is Hunter??
Both those guys could help boost Joe's flailing campaign..
The fact that NEITHER of them want to support Joe is DECIMATING to Joe's campaign..
Biden's move came amid growing anxiety among Biden's supporters that he is unprepared to handle the dual challenges of running a general-election campaign against Trump while simultaneously facing an intensifying Democratic primary contest.
Biden supporters see the writing on the walls..
They are witnessing the beginning of the end of the Biden campaign and they are very scared..
Even the OFFICIAL standard here in Weigantia, Real Clear Politics, says that Democrat's faux impeachment coup is on the rocks..
Hemingway: Why Dems' Latest Attempt To Overturn Election Is Failing
Friday on FNC's "Special Report" panel, "The Federalist" senior editor Mollie Hemingway argued that "people aren't buying" the Democrats' accusation that asking Ukraine to investigate possible corruption is an impeachable offense.
"It's not even just this week. He's actually been saying this going back months and saying it publicly, which is why I think people are having a hard time buying that what he was doing was somehow nefarious because he's been saying it clearly and explicitly, he wants to get to the bottom of some of these things," she explained.
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2019/10/05/hemingway_why_dems_latest_attempt_to_overturn_election_is_failing.html
You see the point??
This faux impeachment coup is not simple.. It's not obvious.. And not only is it defensible, REAL patriotic Americans are LAUGHING at the Democrat Party for contesting something so lame.
President Trump merely asked for some assistance in combating corruption committed by Americans..
Joe Biden EXTORTED a country to fade the heat from his corrupt son..
And SOMEHOW Joe Biden's actions are perfectly acceptable and President Trump's actions are heinous???
On what planet!?? :eyeroll:
But let's turn our attention to (for a moment anyways) to the voters that Democrats have forgotten..
Blue collar voters fear the Democrats have abandoned them
https://nypost.com/2019/10/05/blue-collar-voters-fear-the-democrats-have-abandoned-them/
By ignoring their ENTIRE agenda and concentrating SOLELY on their faux impeachment coup, Democrats are giving a big and mighty **FRAK YOU** to the American voter...
And that will mean a landslide win for President Trump in 2020...
It’s 10:30 a.m. and Dave Green is home for the weekend tinkering with his car. The former president of the local UAW 1112, who once led workers at the shuttered GM Lordstown plant in Ohio, was forced to relocate to Bedford, Ind., this past summer where he now works on the company’s die-cast production line.
Green, whom President Trump famously bashed on Twitter when General Motors announced it was closing the plant, is a devout Democrat and union man who does not care for the president. Like many of his peers across the Midwest, he is waiting and hoping for one of the Democratic presidential candidates to do something inspiring.
“The candidates who have the right message aren’t on the debate stage,” said Green of his former congressman Tim Ryan and Sherrod Brown, the US senator from Ohio who dropped out of the contest before the debates even started. “We need candidates to actually step up and do more than lip service, do something to help change some of the laws that are anti-worker,” he continued. “Because, quite frankly, we’ve been getting our asses handed to us for 20 years or more. And, if something doesn’t change …”
His voice trails off in frustration.
Even the voters who hate President Trump concede that Democrats don't have ANYTHING to offer the American people..
Simply being ANTI-TRUMP is not enough..
Democrats failed to learn that message in 2016 and they are repeating that exact same mistake in 2020..
Of course, there was 2018.. But President Trump was not on the ballot and the ONLY reason the Democrats squeaked ahead to take the House is because dozens of Dem candidates ran as GOP-lite..
There is simply NO PATH to a repeat for the Democrat Party..
As social media, a socialist-leaning base and each successive debate molds the Democrats’ 2020 platform, climate change has emerged as the single most important issue, followed by Medicare for All, more government spending, free college, gun confiscation, reparations for the descendants of slaves, and banning fossil fuels and the jobs they create.
Any emphasis on pro-worker ideals, such as the extension of paid sick days, never seems to come up. “Joe Biden is probably the most pro-union person out of the group running for president. Still, he doesn’t talk about it much when he is on the stage,” said Gary Steinbeck, a retired steelworker from Ohio.
After leading the pack for months, Biden’s slipping in the polls. A recent national survey by Monmouth University put the former vice president in a statistical tie with the uber-progressive Sen. Elizabeth Warren. Now many lifelong working-class Democrats are wondering if their party will abandon them completely in 2020.
Yep.. The Democrats WILL abandon the middles class in 2020.. Unless your black or hispanic or gay, Democrats don't want to hear from you...
When it comes time to vote, black and hispanic Americans will remember who it was that got their unemployment down to the LOWEST POINT EVER...
And they will vote accordingly...
@m,
Your analogy is a little crazy but i get the gist. It feels to you like a setup. The trouble is that the claims appear to be accurate. If someone hates you and points an unloaded weapon at you, perhaps it's not such a good idea to hand them ammo.
Three years later, the party still hasn’t figured out if they want these voters or not.
Some blue-collar voters, meanwhile, don’t want Trump, but they also don’t want a Democratic Party, which they have built and supported — often blindly — since the 1930s, to cede control to a radical left-wing flank.
It was the promise of “card check” legislation, which would have made it easier for workers to unionize, which first energized the labor movement for Obama in 2008, fueling donations and grass-roots support.
But even with Obama in the White House and Democrats holding healthy majorities in both the House and the Senate, working-class voters were rewarded with no labor-law reform in 2009 or 2010.
Even when Democrats HAD the power, including a FILIBUSTER PROOF MAJORITY, they couldn't do DICK for middle class Ameircans..
Why would the middle class want to return to THAT.. Or even worse, see the US become the Venezuela of North America??
Answer: They don't...
So they will hold their nose and vote Trump or stay home by the tens of millions..
Result: President Trump wins re-election..
Hell, even the majority of Weigantians know this to be the case..
JL,
Your analogy is a little crazy
Oh I agree.. It's a LOT crazy.. But it makes the point.
but i get the gist.
"One is honored"
-Robin Williams, BICENTENNIAL MAN
It feels to you like a setup.
Not only that, but the whole idea of a legal "assassination" of a President based on nothing but third person hearsay???
It is totally ridiculous even without the machinations of Democrats..
I really wish CW would chime in on how he feels about third person hearsay being acceptable in the MIDDLE and END part of this investigation..
Here is what I think happened...
Pelosi knows that IG Horowitz's report is coming out soon.. She realizes that it's going to be VERY damning to Democrats..
So, she decides to use ANY pretext to start the impeachment feeding frenzy..
President Trump totally messed up her plans by beating Pelosi to the punch and releasing all the data..
NOW Pelosi is sitting on a huge nothing burger and she is committed to her course of action..
But she can't bring out the whistle blower because she knows she (the whistle blower) won't stand up to scrutiny..
Pelosi is stuck between a rock and a hard case...
The trouble is that the claims appear to be accurate.
I disagree with you there, but even if the claims ARE accurate, it's simply how sausage is made..
Biden's actions in Ukraine are 10 times worse than what President Trump is accused of..
But you and I both know that THAT is exactly how diplomacy works.. The carrot and the stick...
The claim, even if 1000% accurate, is NOT an impeachable offense.
And the pretext the Dems are using to crawl up President Trump's ass??
Simply compounds ridiculousness upon ridiculousness..
If someone hates you and points an unloaded weapon at you, perhaps it's not such a good idea to hand them ammo.
Unless you know that the weapon is defective and will blow back on the person wielding it..
Then you would be EAGER to hand the bullets over, eh?? :D
"EAGER" certainly describes President Trump's actions..
Makes ya wonder, eh?? :D
Hell, "Russia collusion" was 20x more serious than a simple phone call to an ally..
And yet, THAT didn't push Democrats to impeachment..
Now this piddly ass phone call comes out and THAT is justifies impeachment??
Some other factors are at play here... Something we don't know about that is controlling this entire saga...
I am GUESSING it's the Horowitz report..
If not, SOMETHING is going on behind the curtain..
Even IF the claims against President Trump are accurate..
"Fire that prosecutor or you don't get the billion in aid.."
-Joe Biden
"Dig up the dirt on Joe and Hunter Biden or you don't get the military aid package.."
Any normal rational person would be hard pressed to detect any difference in the two actions of the VP and the President...
Now, you may say that Biden's extortion served the country and President Trump's action served President Trump...
But that would be a false statement because it's clear from Shorokin's sworn affidavit that Biden was serving the interests of himself and his son..
The one person who knows is Barack Obama.. And he is remaining silent.. Which would surely indicate that VP Biden had gone rogue in a personal attempt to fade the heat from his son..
AND it can be rationally argued that, since Trump's actions would (in theory) help President Trump to be re-elected, Trump was actually serving the needs of the country..
As far as the Obstruction charge, please PLEASE don't tell me you buy into THAT garbage...
As a result, non-college whites fled the Democrats during the 2010 midterms, when they supported GOP candidates by double digits, turning the House of Representatives red.
Enlarge ImagePresident Barack Obama watches Lisa Mason put the front end of a Jeep Wrangler attached at Chrysler.
President Barack Obama watches Lisa Mason put in the front end of a Jeep Wrangler at Chrysler.EPA
This cohort leans Republican now more than ever; a Gallup poll this year shows they favor the GOP by a whopping 25 percentage points.
It was as if the Democratic Party didn’t understand how much they needed labor. Oddly, it appears they still don’t. “The working-class voters in my county tend to wonder if the party still wants them,” says Mark Hackel, the Democratic chief executive of Macomb County, Mich., where voters favored Trump over Clinton by 11 percentage points. “They’re not really sure where they fit in.”
Democrats are now the Identity Politics ONLY Party...
If yer not black or hispanic or gay or any permeation thereof...
You are't useful to the Democrat Party..
That's specifically what that Squad bimbo said..
Mike Mikus, a Democratic strategist who helped guide Pennsylvania Gov. Tom Wolf’s successful reelection last year, said it would be folly if his party didn’t start wooing the working-class voter.
“It’s a mistake,” Mikus said. “The Democratic Party policies are very helpful and appealing to working-class people. We should most definitely be delivering that message to them and courting them.”
Steinbeck, now a labor leader in Ohio’s Mahoning-Trumbull area, says he finds Trump’s presidency abhorrent and his party’s “inability to make labor part of the conversation or equation” disheartening.
But, as the nomination race starts narrowing, he is hopeful a candidate will emerge who inspires the labor voter. And he hopes labor will strongly back that nominee in the same way they did with Obama to take back the White House.
Unfortunately, it's NOT going to happen..
The only candidate who would be credible to middle class blue collar voters is Joe Biden.
And Democrats have already sealed Joe's fate...
The majority of Weigantians who are rational and know the FACTS and REALITY of the situation know that President Trump is going to be re-elected..
The only point of contention is how big President Trump's win is going to be.
Even IF the claims against President Trump are accurate..
It certainly appears they are, based on the released texts. One difference between the two cases, as you well know, is biden was trying to get rid of Yanukovich corruption that was proven. Donald was trying to make a case against biden that had been proven false.
Also different, despite donald's protestations to the contrary, there was no benefit to either biden from shokin's firing. Shokin himself also tried the same false argument. Perhaps they both got that false narrative from the same place.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/trumps-favor-may-not-seem-worse-than-bidens-threat-but-theres-a-difference/2019/10/04/4a605628-e6eb-11e9-b403-f738899982d2_story.html
It certainly appears they are, based on the released texts.
Yep, but Democrats said the same thing during the Russia Collusion delusion...
But even if factually accurate it doesn't amount to an impeachable offense...
One difference between the two cases, as you well know, is biden was trying to get rid of Yanukovich corruption that was proven.
With not a SINGLE thought to his son?? :D Com'on... I was born AT night.. Not LAST night.. :D
Regardless, it's not factually accurate.. A sworn affidavit says it's not factually accurate..
Donald was trying to make a case against biden that had been proven false.
Except it HASN'T been PROVEN false..
And, if it has, then why doesn't Obama step up???
Except it HASN'T been PROVEN false..
And, if it has, then why doesn't Obama step up???
Why is Hunter Biden in hiding.....
"That rhymes, Marge!!! That rhymes and you know it!!"
-Homer Simpson
:D
... and why is he not stepping up to defend his father???
Between Obama and Hunter and Joe Biden's OWN WORDS...
It's pretty damning for Joe.
And his numbers reflect this..
From the article i cited: "What Biden sought had international backing, and the loan guarantees were ***always*** tied to anti-corruption measures. What Trump sought places our global diplomatic positioning in jeopardy and Ukraine’s future in peril."
"What Biden sought had international backing, and the loan guarantees were ***always*** tied to anti-corruption measures. What Trump sought places our global diplomatic positioning in jeopardy and Ukraine’s future in peril."
SO, you are saying QUID PRO QUO is acceptable if the ends are noble??
So, the ends justifies the means... :D
That it doesn't matter that Joe and Joe's son benefited from the action.. Fading the heat from Joe's son was just "sauce for the goose"..
That's a judgement call.. I prefer the FACTS..
And the FACT is, President Trump was bound by treaty to discuss the corruption committed by Americans in Ukraine.. The fact that it helped President Trump politically??
That's just "sauce for the goose"...
“Rest in peace, irony,” joked MSNBC host Joy Reid Saturday on “AM Joy” after playing clips of the Trump brothers angrily ripping Hunter Biden.
Reid’s guest David Frum quipped: ”When you see poor Eric and poor Don Jr., you realize there are bivalves with more self-awareness than the Trump children.”
Both Reid and Frum referred to Ivanka Trump obtaining several Chinese trademarks for her private company — including for voting machines — last year even as she was dealing with Chinese officials in her role as a senior White House adviser. Trump’s eldest daughter won three trademarks in 2017 on the same day she dined with Chinese President Xi Jinping at Mar-a-Lago. She was granted five trademarks early this year ahead of trade talks with the Chinese.
“You have Ivanka Trump getting Chinese trademarks for voting machines,” noted Reid. “You’ve got Donald Trump Jr. in Indonesia kicking off the sale of luxury condos” — developed with a $500 million cash infusion from a China-owned construction business. “What is happening here?”
Ivanka Trump’s husband, Jared Kushner, meanwhile, met with senior officers of the Anbang investment operation in China “with a view to get hundreds of millions of dollars to rescue his desperately failing project on Fifth Avenue,” noted Frum.
Kushner’s family members solicited Chinese investment in Beijing in 2017 with a presentation including photos of their very own White House adviser and the president — and promises that Chinese could get special U.S. investor visas if they pumped money into the Kushner family business.
The president complaining about corruption in government is like “hearing Al Capone complain about mob activity in Chicago,” quipped Reid’s other guest, Elizabeth Spiers, former editor of the New York Observer, which Kushner once owned.
MSNBC...
'nuff said...
Funny how you demand links of others, Blathy.. But you refuse to put them in yourself..
Simply another indication of your hypocrisy...
JL,
"What Biden sought had international backing, and the loan guarantees were ***always*** tied to anti-corruption measures. What Trump sought places our global diplomatic positioning in jeopardy and Ukraine’s future in peril."
If that were the case here..
Why is OBAMA not stepping up??
The fact that Obama is remaining silent proves that Joe Biden was doing something hinky..
The fact that Hunter Biden is in hiding in a non-extradition country PROVES that Joe Biden was doing something hinky...
Ivanka Trump obtaining several Chinese trademarks for her private company — including for voting machines — last year even as she was dealing with Chinese officials in her role as a senior White House adviser. Trump’s eldest daughter won three trademarks in 2017 on the same day she dined with Chinese President Xi Jinping at Mar-a-Lago. She was granted five trademarks early this year ahead of trade talks with the Chinese.
Sounds to me as though the Trump kids have a lot more than Biden's kid to answer for...
Sounds to me as though the Trump kids have a lot more than Biden's kid to answer for...
Of course you would say that..
Your hatred and bigotry demands it of you..
But, since you give Hunter Biden a pass...
What it sounds like to you is meaningless...
Of course you would say that..
Your hatred and bigotry demands it of you..
But, since you give Hunter Biden a pass...
What it sounds like to you is meaningless.
Nice haiku.
But you've reversed the question. Hunter Biden isn't accused of anything yet. But the Trump kids have been enriching themselves in plain sight.
You have no opinion of that?
@balthasar,
That comparison misses the point. Grown ups are responsible for their own actions. Both ivanka and hunter are culpable for profiting from their parent's public positions. If there's a difference, it's only that Ivanka acted as part of her dad's administration and is therefore subject to official oversight.
That it doesn't matter that Joe and Joe's son benefited from the action
You got that backward bud.
It DOES matter that they DIDN'T benefit.
It DOES matter that they DIDN'T benefit.
You are saying the Hunter DID NOT benefit from Joe Biden's efforts in Ukraine & China..
That it was jut a big coincidence that the **ONLY** two countries that Hunter Biden got BILLIONS from are the **ONLY** two countries where VP Joe Biden was the point man??
You are saying it's just a big coincidence???
REALLY??? :D
Factually, shokin's investigation of burisma began and ended BEFORE hunter biden was hired. Therefore it's impossible to infer a cause effect relationship between them.
You are saying it's just a big coincidence???
Shirley... You jest...
Might as well blame the bidens for Chernobyl while you're at it.
Both ivanka and Hunter are culpable for profiting from their parent's public positions.
If there's a difference, it's only that Ivanka acted as part of her dad's administration and is therefore subject to official oversight.
YUGE difference, I'd say. Hunter was acting as a civilian holding a job. Ivanka (and Jared, and Donald Jr., and Eric) worked in the White House. Big Diff.
No, it's not a coincidence. Hunter biden shamelessly profited from his access to his dad. However, that's where the real story ends. Unless you're wearing a tinfoil hat (or an orange toupee)
So... Ya'all say that President Trump's phone is sufficiently damning that it supports impeachment.
THAT is ya'all's claim.
If this is factually accurate, why would Schiff-head read a "parody" of President Trump's call??
If the actual call is so gosh-darned damning, as ya'all claim, why did Schiff-head have to LIE and make the call sound really really bad.. Why not just read the verbatim text of this alleged really really bad call???
{{{{ccccchhhiiirrrrpppp}}}}{{{chiirrrrrppppp}}
Yea.. That's what usually happens when I catch ya'all in your bullshit and lies... :D
No, it's not a coincidence. Hunter biden shamelessly profited from his access to his dad. However, that's where the real story ends.
Yea.. And President Trump was completely innocent of Russia collusion..
And THAT is where the real story ends..
Unless you're wearing a tinfoil hat..
Pretty funny how no matter what ya level at President Trump and his supporters, it can be turned right around and factually leveled at Trump/America haters.. :D
[China and Ukraine were] the **ONLY** two countries where VP Joe Biden was the point man?
Gotta call bullshit on that claim. I'm quite sure that Biden's portfolio was significantly larger.
The phone call on its own is not sufficient. The phone call, the text conversations, and other evidence not yet released to the public, well may be sufficient.
funny how no matter what ya level at President Trump and his supporters, it can be turned right around and factually leveled at Trump/America haters
Sure, if facts don't matter.
And President Trump was completely innocent of Russia collusion..
Well, given the presumption of innocence, and presuming also that no further evidence comes to light, yes. Perhaps not the case in Ukraine.
So, you're not answering a question. How can Hunter Biden be a concern, when the family in the White House is so considerably worse?
Sure, if facts don't matter.
Apparently they DON'T matter.. To ya'all
Ya'all never have any facts..
And remember.. It's the OFFICIAL Weigantia position that it is virtually GUARRANTEED that the ONLY result from this whole Democrat faux impeachment coup...
President Trump remains in office..
Boy how that must SUCK for you, Blathy... :D
The FACTS & reality is TOTALLY against ya and yer bullshit claims... :D
President Trump was completely innocent of Russia collusion..
And I am the King of Persia.
The phone call on its own is not sufficient.
That is the COMPLETE opposite of what ya'all were saying a day or so ago..
Blathy came right out and said that the so-called "whistle blower" is not needed. That the phone call alone is sufficient.
So which is it???
Gotta call bullshit on that claim. I'm quite sure that Biden's portfolio was significantly larger.
Yea?? You were "pretty sure" that Trump was going to be frog marched from the oval office..
You were "pretty sure" that Hillary was going to be POTUS..
Let's face the FACTS, Blathy..
Yer "pretty sure" is **ALWAYS** wrong..
I didn't say that. If i did feel free to link my mistake and I'll own it.
But you won't answer the question. What about Trump's kids? Surely he sees the graft going on right in front of him.
Oh, the phone call is sufficient for impeachment.
That's a given.
What we're investigating now is just how deep this goes. So far we seem to have implicated the Secretary of State, the Attorney General, and the VP among others in this scheme, and we're only a week from starting.
OK Jags are on... :D
I didn't say that. If i did feel free to link my mistake and I'll own it.
You didn't correct Blathy when he said it..
Same thing as agreeing with it..
The Democrat/Charlottesville rule..
You were "pretty sure" that Hillary was going to be POTUS
I'm "pretty sure" that she won the popular vote.
Do you honestly think that Biden was only given two things to do? Do you think he's Pence?
Oh, the phone call is sufficient for impeachment.
That's a given.
JL says it isn't..
Which of you is factually accurate??
I'm "pretty sure" that she won the popular vote.
ANd if we were talking about the vanity vote, you would have a point..
But we're not so, as usual, you don't..
Come talk to me when you have FACTS...
Probably will never see you again..
You know i don't buy the ex-silentio fallacy. Who has time to correct every screwball hypothesis?
if we were talking about the vanity vote, you would have a point..
The "vanity" vote? Don't you mean the POPULAR vote?
Why are you so afraid of that? Because your point of view has never actually been popular?*
*not in this century.
You know i don't buy the ex-silentio fallacy.
I know YOU don't.
But every other Weigantian does... Especially when it's applied to someone with a -R after their name..
Who has time to correct every screwball hypothesis?
You mean, besides me?? :D
The "vanity" vote? Don't you mean the POPULAR vote?
Popular is vanity, dipshit..
Sgt. Whorely,
This is what has to be so frustrating for you
Me?? FRUSTRATED??
BBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Yes. You! FRUSTRATED!!!
I’m really disappointed in you. I spent all that time finishing your little story in the style that you had used and you ignore it completely. You cannot fault the facts of the matter that I presented, so you choose to attack the part where I offer my opinion of you. You are truly becoming a master in the art of deflection!
Even IF the claims against President Trump are accurate..
"Fire that prosecutor or you don't get the billion in aid.."
-Joe Biden
"Dig up the dirt on Joe and Hunter Biden or you don't get the military aid package.."
Any normal rational person would be hard pressed to detect any difference in the two actions of the VP and the President...<
Any member of a cult that believes that they are a”normal rational person” is sadly mistaken. For those that don’t worship at the Cheeto king’s alter, the difference is clear: Biden was acting on behalf of the country; Trump was acting on behalf of himself and NOT our country.
It’s odd that you think quid pro quo is always illegal. When Trump let the government shutdown and refused to get the government running again unless the Democrats gave in to his demands on funding the wall, that was illegal? Trump should be charged for that, too?
MSNBC...
'nuff said...
Master of Deflection strikes again! He cannot dispute the content, so he just attacks the news source. It is the same gimmick every day with him!
You are saying the Hunter DID NOT benefit from Joe Biden's efforts in Ukraine & China..
That it was jut a big coincidence that the **ONLY** two countries that Hunter Biden got BILLIONS from are the **ONLY** two countries where VP Joe Biden was the point man??
Hunter made BILLIONS off of the two deals? Trump hasn’t made anywhere near that amount in all of his career, yet Hunter Biden did it in just two deals! Wow! No wonder Trump hates him so much — Hunter Biden is 1,000,000x the business genius that Trump claims to be!
If Hunter can turn a $50k/month deal into BILLIONS of dollars as you keep claiming, then we definitely want his dad as president! Hopefully Hunter will be made the SEC’s chairperson...which Republicans won’t have a problem with since nepotism is no longer against the law if it is done by the President.
Cockholster...
I’m really disappointed in you. I spent all that time finishing your little story in the style that you had used and you ignore it completely.
That's because your immature and fact-less comments are EASY to ignore..
BBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHA
“An impeachment inquiry which will turn into an open-ended fishing expedition … The American people are smarter. They want this politically motivated witch hunt to end … Let’s stop the politics. Let’s really talk about bipartisanship.”
"This impeachment is a deadly plant that has flowered in the toxic soil of partisanship. Given the highly contentious nature of the charges against the president, there is no question in my mind that the congressional leadership should have first established a bipartisan process for investigating the serious allegations"
Apparently, Democrats were a LOT smarter and loved their country more under Clinton than they are or do today...
Fascinating how that is, eh? :D
"In my view, the House didn’t even try to locate the common ground … the fact is that by the end of last year, our two major political parties were at war with each other over the allegations against the president."
It's like Democrats were looking into a crystal ball...
"Congress has not once removed a president, not once in 211 years. The Constitution places the burden for such a grave step very high. Such a showing is not only to protect our nation from partisan prosecution, but also to impose safeguards that are necessary, given the severity of the potential punishment – a political death penalty, as House Manager Lindsey Graham said."
It would be nice if Democrats had the decency to at least be ashamed of their actions..
But the coup plotters show no shame, no remorse.. They happily do Putin's bidding and gleefully assist in destroying this great country..
REAL patriotic Americans will remember these nefarious actions of the Democrats at the ballot box..
"If the evidence required to convict a president of the United States in an impeachment trial is allowed to be less than that required in a shoplifting trial, the constitutional foundation for the presidency will disintegrate before our very eyes. That is something that a few future presidents in this body ought to consider for just a moment"
Oh.... SNAP...
“The Framers of the Constitution never intended the availability of impeachment as a license for a fishing expedition.”
And yet, that is EXACTLY what Democrats are doing, based on NOTHING but hearsay.. And third person hearsay to boot!!
"The Framers of the Constitution knew that the greatest danger associated with impeachment was the presence of partisan factions that could dictate the outcome."
-Joe Biden
Apparently, Joe Biden was a very wise man.. At one time..
"I am gonna beat you like a drum!!!"
Joe Biden
Today??? Not so much... :^(
If this is factually accurate, why would Schiff-head read a "parody" of President Trump's call??
If the actual call is so gosh-darned damning, as ya'all claim, why did Schiff-head have to LIE and make the call sound really really bad.. Why not just read the verbatim text of this alleged really really bad call???
Personally, I think Schiff decided to “Bill Barr” the rough transcript and set the tone for how people should read the full transcript before Barr could. Barr was successful pulling this off with his not-a-summary-summary of the Mueller Report, and I think Schiff did this to block Barr from doing it again. You had no problem with Barr’s interpretation of Mueller’s report, even when Barr tried to deceive the public by claiming Mueller made findings that he clearly did not by Barr’s not publishing Mueller’s complete comments. Claiming someone admitted to a crime when they said, “I did...kill him”, when what they actually said was, “I did NOT kill him” is lying!
The biggest difference is that Schiff wasn’t claiming his account of the phone call was the actual official transcript.
Cadet Whorely,
Who the hell are you quoting? Yourself? You call Balthy a hypocrite for not posting a link, but at least his post said exactly where it came from and who was talking!
And it’s funny that you believe the impeachment trial has taken place before the House has had a chance to draw up the Articles for Impeachment. But I do agree with you that Trump’s confession pretty much ensures it will happen!
Cockholster...
Who the hell are you quoting?
ALL quotes were from Democrats, dipshit...
Gods, you are such a complete and utter Party slave..
So a whistleblower asking for an investigation of Trump’s actions based on third person hearsay is wrong, but Trump asking a foreign government to investigate a US citizen based on conspiracy theories that do not even rise to the level of qualifying as “hearsay” is OK?
Why did Trump ask a foreign government to conduct the investigation of a US citizen — a citizen that the foreign government has no authority over, mind you — when his own law enforcement agencies won’t investigate Biden because there is no evidence to warrant an investigation?
ALL quotes were from Democrats, dipshit...
Gods, you are such a complete and utter Party slave..
Quotes that you couldn’t bother to cite the person who you claim to be quoting... yeah, it’s my fault that you are a pathological liar who cannot defend his own comments.
The fact you think hearsay would invalidate the decision for conducting an investigation is just further proof that you lie when you claim to have been a LEO!
Just because your wife has to dress you up as Cagney to her Lacey in order to stomach sex with you, you still are not and have never been a member of law enforcement!
Trump is now giving Rick Perry the "credit" for that "perfect" phone call.
I guess somebody forgot to explain to Benedict Donald that blaming others is more like an admission of conspiracy than a legitimate defense. :)
Chris, we all know of your - shall we call it 'soft spot'? - for Bernie. But I respectfully suggest that the Most Impressive Democrat of the Week should include most of the presidential candidates.
For one thing, the media regularly reports the Trump campaign's "massive haul", comparing his fundraising to the individual Democratic candidates. What that omits, of course, is that the combined contributions of donors to Democrats is at least near, if not exceeding, the Republican donors.
Also, Sanders is not alone in relying on 'small donor' contributions.
https://www.politico.com/news/2019/10/05/bernie-sanders-elizabeth-warren-donors-fundraising-029053
What that omits, of course, is that the combined contributions of donors to Democrats is at least near, if not exceeding, the Republican donors.
Facts to support???
None?? Yea, that's what I thought..
Cockholster,
Quotes that you couldn’t bother to cite the person who you claim to be quoting.
Yunno, CH.. Yer right.. I should give the attributes..
I'll repost the quotes again with the proper attributes..
And you will ignore them because you have absolutely NO DEFENSE for their (and your) hypocrisy... :D
“We are here today because the Republicans in the House are paralyzed with hatred of President Clinton. And until the Republicans free themselves of this hatred, our country will suffer.”
-Nancy Pelosi
Hay cockholster..
Isn't it funny that if you change "Republicans" to "Democrats" and change "President Clinton" to "President Trump", this quote of hers is dead on ballz accurate...
Defend the hypocrisy, moron..
You can't, so you'll ignore it.. :eyeroll:
"It is our constitutional duty to give the president the benefit of the doubt on the facts"
-Joe Biden
Looks like Uncle Joe called it dead on ballz accurate..
Too bad he has lost all semblance of civility and decorum..
"Benjamin Franklin called impeachment, 'a substitute for assassination'..."
-Jerrold Nadler
That's the Democrat Party. The Assassinate President Trump Party.. :eyeroll:
“An impeachment inquiry which will turn into an open-ended fishing expedition … The American people are smarter. They want this politically motivated witch hunt to end … Let’s stop the politics. Let’s really talk about bipartisanship.”
-Rep Eliot Engel, D-NY
Iddn't it funny how Democrats totally and utterly opposed impeachment on CONSTITUTIONAL grounds when it was a Democrat being impeached..
But they are all for such a gross "assassination" of a sitting President when it's a Republican..
The hypocrisy from the Democrat Party is astounding..
“It is time to move forward … the world economy is in crisis and cries out for American leadership … the American people cry out for us to solve the problems facing America like health care, education and ensuring that seniors have a decent retirement.”
-Chuck Schumer
Once again.. It's astounding the 180 degree turn that Democrats have done when the POTUS had a -R after their name instead of a -D...
Cockholster, you got awful quiet?? Pussycat got yer tongue??
BBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
“Jefferson feared that even our process for impeachment could be a formidable partisan weapon. He feared that a determined faction in Congress would use it ‘… for getting rid of any man whom they consider as dangerous to their views, and I do not know that we could count on one-third in an emergency.’”
-Dick Durbin
Democrats were against impeachment before they were for impeachment..
Anyone who thinks this is NOT about the -D or the -R after the President's name is fooling themselves..
Yunno.. It's kinda a pain that CH insisted on reading all the quotes again...
But hay... If that's what CH wants.. :D
"This impeachment is a deadly plant that has flowered in the toxic soil of partisanship. Given the highly contentious nature of the charges against the president, there is no question in my mind that the congressional leadership should have first established a bipartisan process for investigating the serious allegations"
-Rep Ron Wyden, D-OR
So, how about it Dims??
Where is your "bipartisan" investigation??
One or two Trump/America haters with a -R after their name doesn't cut it..
“In the past year, despite the scandal that ran on the front page nearly every day, our country has prospered. Our economy is growing. Our waters and air are cleaner. Our communities are safer. Our education system is stronger. America is not poised on the brink of disaster.”
-Sen Patty Murray, D-WA
It's amazing how this current faux impeachment coup mirrors the last one.. :D
And the results are likely to be the same, too...
A massive overreach by the Dems resulting in an utter shellacking and decimation in 2020... :D
And the award for the MOST IRONIC!!????
“Democracy is threatened when a fair legal process is sacrificed to appease the passions of a few … The power to impeach a president should not be casually used to remove a president, overturn an election, simply because we don’t like him or his policies.”
-Mad Maxine Waters
Oh, the irony... OOOOOooooo the irony..... :D
What's the matter, cockholster??? You have no response to these DEMOCRATS who are soooo against impeachment??
None???
BBBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
And the RUNNER UP for MOST IRONIC
“The Framers of the Constitution never intended the availability of impeachment as a license for a fishing expedition.”
Rep Sheila Jackson-Lee, D-TX
The hypocrisy is as undeniable as it is palpable..
Irony upon irony upon irony...
Hypocrisy upon hypocrisy upon hypocrisy...
"Mr. Speaker, we should be standing here debating the future of Social Security. We should be standing here debating health care. We should be standing here debating education for our children and how we can protect the environment.
Instead, we are participating in a political charade. Republicans want to do what they could not do in an election – defeat Bill Clinton. Well, I have news for you. The American people are watching. Beware the wrath of the American people, Mr. Speaker, beware."
-Rep John Lewis, D-GA
Remember, these aren't MY WORDs... These are DEMOCRAT words...
Funny how the words today are the complete opposite of the words they used when it was a DEMOCRAT facing impeachment..
Anyone who believes this is NOT a -D vs -R issue is delusional...
Let's hear from more from Joe Biden..
"It would have been wrong for Richard Nixon to have been removed from office based upon a purely partisan vote. No president should be removed from office merely because one party enjoys a commanding lead in either house of the Congress"
-Joe Biden
Amazing, iddn't.. The hypocrisy is simply amazing..
And coming from JOE BIDEN of all people.. I thought ol' Joe was a straight shooter..
He's just another filthy politician.. :^(
Oh how the mighty have fallen..
OK, I am gonna sprinkle these quotes throughout the day, but we have a LOT of new business to cover..
I want to thank all of the Weigantians that are too SCARED to comment and cede the battlefield to me.. :D
It's nice of ya'all to concede that ya'all have no FACTS to support any rebuttal.. :D
Goodwin: ‘Groundhog’ Dems again ‘left’ behind
Recall that House Speaker Nancy Pelosi accused Trump of requesting foreign help in his re-election campaign and assured skeptics it was a clear violation that was serious and easy for the public to understand. She wanted a quick inquiry and is resisting calls for a floor vote, believing she could avoid the formality of putting vulnerable Dems on the spot.
But a funny thing — several funny things — are happening on the way to clarity, simplicity and speed.
The lack of an obvious quid pro quo in the phone call transcript was the first blow to Pelosi’s plan. Trump never mentioned withholding military aide, and reports say Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky wasn’t even aware of a delay.
https://nypost.com/2019/10/05/goodwin-groundhog-dems-again-left-behind/
It's hilarious that Democrats want to impeach over this...
Colluding with Russia is a FAR worse charge, yet we found out that THAT charge was nothing but hot air from the Democrats..
Now they want to impeach over a PHONE CALL!!??
BBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Odumbo was caught selling his fealty to Putin in exchange for "space" to wining Odumbo's election..
Ya'all didn't bat an eye..
Joe Biden CONFESSED to quid pro quo and extortion...
Ya'all ignored it completely..
But let President Trump simply ask for a favor from an ally??
Ya'all go apeshit crazy...
This is why it's IMPOSSIBLE for any sane rational patriotic American to take the Dumbocrats seriously..
Because Dumbocrats AREN'T being serious..
They are being laughable...
Moreover, Zelensky said publicly he did not feel pressured to open an investigation into the Bidens. That puts both the quid and the quo on shaky ground.
Even the expected holy grail of text messages and testimony show that some American officials had different interpretations of the president’s intent, which muddles any possible sense of certainty. Impeachment based on mere opinion, often just a reflection of partisanship, cannot possibly win broad public support in a country so polarized.
The impeachers also blundered on the Joe Biden issue in Ukraine. By denouncing Trump for requesting an investigation, they make it appear they don’t want to know whether Biden corrupted his vice presidency to enrich his son. In effect, they inadvertently exposed the former veep’s soft underbelly while telling the public to ignore it.
Good luck with that. Trump smells blood, and his slashing away could be the death knell of Biden’s campaign, leaving the Dems further divided and possibly damaging the eventual nominee.
Yunno, I am kinda hoping I am wrong and JL & DSWS are right that Joe Biden will be the nominee..
I'll have to vote for Biden, but it would be worth it to see a candidate so mauled and decimated by the FACTS and reality, he'll be lucky to carry his home state... :D
Joe Biden's corruption rivals that of Hillary Clintons'.. And you see how President Trump totally decimated Clinton in the General.. :D
President Trump eats pieces of shit like Biden for breakfast!!
"President Trump eats pieces of shit for breakfast??"
Baaa daaa da... :D
The media’s lack of curiosity about Biden is also revealing. Journalists are supposed to have insatiable appetites for scandal, and here is a potentially huge one hiding in plain sight, yet nobody’s interested.
Of course, giving Biden a pass is the flip side of the media’s fetish for seeing a scandal in every breath Trump takes. Bizarrely, they see his call for a probe of the Bidens and Ukraine’s role in the 2016 spying on his campaign as proof of his own guilt.
If those were the only problems, impeachment would be a very hard sell. But there are others, too.
This faux impeachment by Democrats is a coup, pure and simple..
A way to try and nullify a free, fair, legal, democratic and Constitutional election that Democrats lost...
Future historians will be none too kind to the Democrats of this era...
They include Rep. Adam Schiff being the grand inquisitor. His obsession with nailing Trump removes any pretense of fair play, and he compounded it with his dishonesty over when he first learned about the CIA agent’s complaint.
The idea that the agent is a genuine whistleblower is a threshold test of credibility, and, thanks in part to Schiff, legitimate doubts are growing. The inspector general’s finding that the agent showed “arguable political bias” and supported a “rival political candidate” can’t be ignored.
Then, too, Schiff’s early touting of the complaint on Twitter, long before he said he saw the document, suggests the whistleblower may be part of a partisan putsch.
Indeed, one way to read the entire episode is that it is a continuation of the scandalous CIA-FBI attempt to block Trump from winning the White House, and then drive him out of office. My guess is that the more we learn about the agent’s connection to Democrats, the less credible he and they will be.
The so-called "whistle blower" has absolution NO CREDIBILITY whatsoever.. She is obviously a Democrat plant..
Which is why Democrats are hiding her and won't let Republicans question her.. Her story won't hold up under scrutiny...
Finally, there are early signs of a public backlash against Pelosi. Her decision to try to undo the 2016 election on such a slender thread and under suspect circumstances is motivating Trump and his supporters.
As the president told me about the daily combat, “It sounds strange to say I’m energized, but I love it, I love it.”
His fundraising set a record haul of $125 million and the surge of 50,000 small donors was especially impressive.
To be sure, we are in the early innings of what is certain to be a months-long slog. The momentum will shift frequently, and the outcome is unpredictable.
Looks like the claim that ALL Democrat totals for donors is larger than President Trump's is PROVEN to be bullshit..
Once again, I have to ask..
If the FACTS are so damning, why do you Trump/America haters have to LIE to make a point??
Another question that will never be addressed because the answer is so damning to ya'all... :D
However, I got a glimpse of a worst-case scenario for Dems at a recent gathering with 10 friends. All New Yorkers, about half have been supporters of the president.
While nearly that many believe the president will be impeached by the House, none thinks he will be convicted by the Senate.
Here’s the real shocker: All 10 believe he will be re-elected.
That pretty much mirrors what we have here in Weigantia..
1 Trump support.. Several rational souls.. And a myriad of Trump/America haters...
And the MAJORITY all agrees that President Trump will win re-election.. :D
OUCH.. That's gotta hurt, eh? :D
OK.. So, we have heard from a Democrat on the faux impeachment coup...
Let's see if I can find some Trump supporters and get THEIR thoughts.. :D
Trump Knows Ukraine Owns the Democrats
Joe Biden & Son have hardly been the only ones playing footsie with Ukraine.
The Ukraine Sideshow
Notably, much of the controversy surrounding the absurd Trump-Russia collusion delusion emanated from sources linked to Ukraine. You see, as a country under active Russian military attack, Ukraine’s very survival is on the line. The Ukrainians were petrified by Trump’s stated desire to negotiate with Russia over several points of contention — including on the matter of Ukraine. To Kiev, this sounded as though Trump, if elected to the presidency, would sell the besieged country out to Moscow (although just the opposite has occurred under Trump).
Thus, Ukraine’s leaders acted assiduously to secure the protection and loyalty of the U.S. government by coopting influential individuals of America’s political class. Many of these Western elites were powerful members of the Democratic Party. Also, the Democrats have long had close associations with Ukraine’s leaders going back to 1994, when the Clinton administration negotiated an alliance with Ukraine wherein the Ukrainians dismantled the 300 nuclear weapons that the Soviet Union left behind in their country, in exchange for sweetheart foreign aid deals and guarantees of American military protection, should the Russians ever return.
https://spectator.org/trump-knows-ukraine-owns-the-democrats/
It's amazing how THE FACTS paint a completely different picture than the pic that Democrats are painting.. :D
Considering the Democrats' track record against President Trump is a big fat ZERO...
I am disinclined to acquiesce to the Democrats' version of events..
"I am disinclined to acquiesce to your request. That means 'NO'..."
-Captain Barbossa, PIRATES OF THE CARIBBEAN
In other words, Democrats have been WRONG about everything in the past..
Why should anyone believe them now??
{{{cccccchhhhiiiirrrrpppp}}}{ccchhirrpp}
Yea.. That's what I thought... :eyeroll:
Encrypted Texts Prove Trump Innocent
Before the impeachment (non)scandal broke, an American State Department official assigned to the embassy in Ukraine, Bill Taylor, texted with America’s ambassador to the European Union, Gordon Sondland, and the Trump administration’s special representative to Ukraine, Kurt Volker, over the State Department’s encrypted text messaging service. In these texts, Taylor announced his objections to the freezing of the foreign aid on the grounds that it was being done to further President Trump’s reelection campaign.
Sondland, who has close ties to the president and his inner circle, explicitly stated that the president did not want “quid quo pro” from their dealings with Ukraine. In other words, the president was not seeking damaging material on Joe Biden from Ukraine’s government in exchange for releasing foreign aid money to Ukraine. Trump’s moves in Ukraine had to do with overall corruption and, more importantly, ensuring American taxpayers were not being bilked in the form of generous foreign aid to a broken government.
I am glad the texts were brought out into the open..
They PROVE President Trump's innocence in the charges by the coup plotters..
Only a biased and non-context and cherry-picked read of the text (IE spin) would make anyone believe that the texts are anything but exculpatory..
Once again, we have ya'all's hysterical and unfounded SPIN and lies....
The Democrats claim that Trump attempted to garner a bribe from Ukraine; that he explicitly wanted damaging information on Joe Biden heading into the 2020 presidential campaign in exchange for giving the $400 million (plus the lethal aid) to Ukraine. This does not appear to be the case at all. What’s more, the recently released encrypted text messages between Kurt Volker, Bill Taylor, and Gordon Sondland indicate that the president and his team were less interested in damaging Joe Biden’s presidential campaign than they were in getting to the bottom of potential Ukrainian malfeasance (while using U.S. foreign aid as leverage to get Ukraine to shape up its behavior). And, it should be noted here, the pursuit of corruption is a legitimate function of the U.S. government — and since Donald Trump is the chief executive, he is well within his rights to inquire about potential corruption in foreign countries with the leaders of those countries.
And then we have the FACTS....
Amazing how the two are completely and utterly opposite..
:D
President Trump clearly does not believe that Ukraine is a land worth potentially warring against nuclear-armed Russia over (he’s right about that, by the way). Continuous, unquestioning, foreign and lethal aid to Ukraine only destabilizes the region further while doing little to mitigate the risk of a large-scale conflict with nuclear-armed Russia — and Trump intuitively understands this.
That so many powerful people from America’s political class appear to have been bought and paid for by Ukrainian partisans is disturbing enough. That this reality could help precipitate a potential conflict with Russia is even worse. More than that, though, the idea that the president cannot demand that U.S. taxpayers get a better deal for risking so much by giving so much to a failing state, like Ukraine; or that a U.S. president cannot discuss anti-corruption investigations with his Ukrainian counterpart — without the risk of being made to endure a wasteful impeachment inquiry — is even more galling. The Democrats are desperate and must be punished at the polls for their continuing absurd behavior.
And the president must be allowed to conduct matters of state unimpeded by congressional overreach … just as the Constitution envisioned the president doing.
The US Constitution is on the President's side..
The coup plotters are completely and utterly wrong..
It's really THAT simple...
OK I have my chickens and animals to feed and check the fence line..
I'll give ya'all some time to catch up... :D
Michale, I would be more likely to read what you post if there were less of it. Another dozen posts? Scroll past. If it were just another one or two, I well might read.
DSWS...
Fair enough... I am willing to do as you ask on a trial basis. And it's a BIG ask because I had another 2 dozen or so comments lined up.. :D
I can't let my fans down, eh? :D
But I'll let you in on a little secret.. My "kryptonite" as it were...
Distract me with a couple of responses to my comments. Once we're I am in debate mode rather than announce mode, the comment count will dwindle considerably... :D My back and forth with JL yesterday supports the claim..
I like your logical and rational mind. You, more or less (more than everyone else, less than me.. :D) say what you actually think, regardless of whether it's politically popular or not..
You are only 1 of 4 people who could actually pull it off.. :D
Wanna give it a shot??? Pick any 2 comments and blast away.. I promise you, when it comes to politics, I have a very thick skin.. :D
As an aside...
HOW DO YOU FRIGHTEN TODAY'S GENERATION??
Put them in a locked room with a rotary phone, an analog watch, a TV with no remote (add rabbit ears for extra fun)
And leave directions for all of the afore, written in cursive.
:D
That so many powerful people from America’s political class appear to have been bought and paid for by Ukrainian partisans is disturbing enough. That this reality could help precipitate a potential conflict with Russia is even worse. More than that, though, the idea that the president cannot demand that U.S. taxpayers get a better deal for risking so much by giving so much to a failing state, like Ukraine..
So what's your link for this stuff - Russia? Sounds and reads a lot like propaganda to me.
Or maybe we should ask the Kurds just how loyal Trump is to our allies and friends. I'd bet they'd have a few choice words for him right now..
So now it appears Blotus & gang were trying to use Ukraine as a vehicle for $ to pour into their personal bank accounts.
So what's your link for this stuff - Russia? Sounds and reads a lot like propaganda to me.
Jesus, Blathy.. You have to be SPOON fed??
Is your mind so closed and locked by Party slavery, you cannot have a SINGLE independent thought??
My comments **ALWAYS** have links associated with them.. It's not my fault you are too stoopid and brain dead to find them..
Looking at comment #137, it's YOU who never link to yer bullshit..
Or maybe we should ask the Kurds just how loyal Trump is to our allies and friends. I'd bet they'd have a few choice words for him right now..
Were they as "choice" as the words DEMOCRATS had for Kurds before Dumbocrats learned they could use the Kurds as a bludgeon to beat Trump over the head with??
President Trump is putting America first..
I know, I know.. You are used to putting Americans LAST...
That's why you are all for open borders and free health care for illegal immigrant criminals..
And apparently Blotus abandons the Kurds to Turkey for slaughter.
After first having the Kurds dismantle their protective fortifications.
Well, you missed my point, as usual Mike.
Of course the article is written by Brandon Weichert, the same guy that penned:
A Deep Cleansing of the Deep State Is Coming
In which he spends a good part of his time preferring Russian intelligence to our own. For Trump.
President Trump is putting America first..
Yeah, and just how does abandoning the Kurds accomplish this? Huh?
Paula: Maybe it's a complete mis-understanding of Thanksgiving.
[231] Balthasar: Heh.
Pentagon Subpoenaed
https://intelligence.house.gov/uploadedfiles/2019-10-07.eec_engel_schiff_to_esper-dod_re_subpoena.pdf
Office of Management and Budget Subpoenaed
https://intelligence.house.gov/uploadedfiles/2019-10-07.eec_engel_schiff_to_vought-_omb_re_subpoena.pdf
[233-234] Kick: Yep. Question is will they comply and if they don't what then? So we'll see. But good.
Well, you missed my point, as usual Mike.
You never MAKE any relevant point..
And you never have ANY facts to support the irrelevant points you try to make..
Of course the article is written by Brandon Weichert, the same guy that penned:
Of course, you never have a link to support your claims..
Why is that??
Yeah, and just how does abandoning the Kurds accomplish this? Huh?
Are you really THAT stoopid???
I mean, I know yer stoopid..
Are you really THAT stoopid??
Xanax Girl,
Kick: Yep. Question is will they comply and if they don't what then? So we'll see.
Of course, they won't comply..
It's a coup...
Why should ANYONE comply???
"The DOD does not endorse a Turkish operation in Northern Syria. We will work w/our @NATO allies & Coalition partners to reiterate to Turkey the possible destabilizing consequences of potential actions to Turkey, the region, & beyond. Full statement here: https://defense.gov/Newsroom/Releases/Release/Article/1982590/statement-attributable-to-assistant-to-the-secretary-of-defense-for-public-affa/"
Turks are bombing - thanks to Blotus.
Mitt Romney:
"This President’s decision to abandon our Kurdish allies in Northern Syria is ultimately a victory for Assad, Russia, Iran, and ISIS. The Administration must immediately reconsider withdrawing the few remaining U.S. troops who are playing a vital peacekeeping role."
"This President’s decision to abandon our Kurdish allies in Northern Syria is ultimately a victory for Assad, Russia, Iran, and ISIS. The Administration must immediately reconsider withdrawing the few remaining U.S. troops who are playing a vital peacekeeping role."
It's funny how Mitt Romney's word is shit..
Right up to the point that he says what ya'all want to hear.. :D
Pure unadulterated hypocrisy..
It's a Democrat defining characteristic..
[219]
The US Constitution is on the President's side.
The Constitution is on Congress's side. All the powers granted by the people to the federal government are given explicitly to Congress. Aside from the veto, the president merely has the power to do what Congress tells him. (Or her, eventually.)
Unfortunately, Congress isn't on its own side, and has given over almost all the decisions to the executive branch. Some it gives to professional civil servants, but too much it gives to the president. The presidency was too imperial four years ago, and it will be too imperial eight years from now.
The Constitution has nothing to say about whether opposition research is a "thing of value" in the context of a political campaign, nor about whether any such thing of value may be solicited from a foreign entity. Rather, it gives Congress the power "to make all laws necessary and proper to carrying into execution the foregoing powers, and any other power given by this Constitution to the United States or any officer thereof." (Quoted from memory. Probably not quite exact, but that's the gist. It's in Article I section 8 with the list of powers expressly granted.)
The "unitary executive" nonsense is absolutely unsupported by anything in the actual document.
DSWS,
I was just getting ready to respond to this when the missus called me for dinner..
Mind if we pick it up in the AM??
This is officially a dead thread.
President Trump clearly does not believe that Ukraine is a land worth potentially warring against nuclear-armed Russia over (he’s right about that, by the way). Continuous, unquestioning, foreign and lethal aid to Ukraine only destabilizes the region further while doing little to mitigate the risk of a large-scale conflict with nuclear-armed Russia — and Trump intuitively understands this.
Dear God, did Putin write this? That a person who lies about being a cop and an MP in the military also supports the Coward-and-Chief’s decision to do the bidding of Russia (and do everything in his power to allow it to take over Ukraine) shouldn’t surprise anyone here — but is still incredibly pathetic!
The majority of the money that Trump diverted from military building projects to go build his wall was earmarked for projects in countries bordering Russia to help secure them from Russian attacks.
We know that he has kept the transcripts from his conversations with Putin secret from our government agencies whose job it is to keep records of these conversations. We know that he kowtows to anything Putin says. We know that he is grateful to Russia for interfering in the 2016 election and getting him in the White House.
But working so hard to get the sanctions against Russia removed should make even his most loyal cult members question where Trump’s true loyalties reside!
Mind if we pick it up in the AM??
Fine by me. On the new thread, I presume.
That would be correct.