Obama Was Wrong
[Program Note: Today, I simply couldn't bring myself to review the past week as usual here, so instead of the normal Friday Talking Points column all I have to offer is a rant. Hopefully by next week -- especially since there will be no House Select Committee hearings to watch -- this column will return to its normal format, but today I just couldn't. I had a few things to get off my chest, instead.]
Barack Obama created many memorable soundbites and campaign slogans, but one of the best-remembered is (as he phrased it in a tweet): "There are no red states or blue states, just the United States." This call for unity in politics was generally well-received, since it spoke to (as another former president once put it) "the better angels of our nature."
But what is becoming more and more obvious is how wrong Obama got this. His words sound blissfully naive, at this point. Because we are devolving further into the Divided States of America, seemingly with every passing day. Today's Supreme Court decision which overturned Roe v. Wade is merely another milestone on this grim journey.
Fundamental rights can no longer be seen as being protected by our national government. That's the biggest takeaway from the court's decision. John Roberts no longer leads the Supreme Court, he has been reduced instead to merely following the increased activism of the five justices who are now gleefully anticipating dictating further radical changes to American law and American life. Roberts is now a footnote on the court which bears his name, plain and simple.
Bridging the political divide in America has become harder and harder to accomplish, which is no surprise given the fact that politics has become so tribal here. Members of both parties don't see the other side of the aisle as the "loyal opposition" any more, they increasingly see the other party as a fundamental and existential threat to the future of the country. The other party is not just wrong, they are a threat. They are the enemy. This does not bode well for the future, obviously.
Republicans (and the radical faction on the Supreme Court) simply cannot be described as "conservative" any more, unless you redefine the term to mean "conserving what existed in the 1800s." According to today's decision, any law which didn't exist back then is fair game to toss out. This is not an exaggeration. We're now going to have to live with the views of justices which state that any law without a long historical precedent can be thrown out. Given that life in the 1800s was not very technologically advanced, this could mean any law which deals with any subject that didn't exist back then could just as easily be overturned. That is a horrifying concept, but that's where we now find ourselves.
Republicans used to get angry over what they deemed "activist judges," but it's a safe bet not many of them will be echoing that language today, or in the weeks to come. The radicals on the Supreme Court simply don't care about such restraint. Laws they deem politically acceptable will be strongly bolstered, while laws they don't approve of will be eviscerated, with no judicial or legal consistency whatsoever. The court has always been political, but many have pretended the opposite was true for decades now. This is now on display for all to see.
It's not just the court, of course. Republicans have all but given up on being for anything anymore, instead they have gone full reactionary -- they define themselves by what they are against. The national party didn't even bother putting out a party platform in 2020, meaning they've given up on even pretending to care about any policy ideas since 2016. Instead, they are against anything the Democrats propose, and that's all they feel they need to tell the voters.
What are the Republican proposals for lowering gas prices? Or inflation? Or improving healthcare? Or racial relations? Or gun violence? Or political violence? They have none. "The other guy's ideas are wrong" is all they feel they need.
Red states are currently in a frenzy of passing laws which either roll back any semblance of modern progress or are designed to use the power of the state to punish their ideological enemies. This is not "small-government conservatism," but they simply don't care any more. Donald Trump has taught them all that the only thing that matters in politics is letting your id roam free. Create some scapegoat and then demonize it to your base voters, and then pass laws which "solve" the non-existent problem. Then move on to the next imaginary scapegoat -- rinse and repeat. That's their playbook these days.
This is on display in numerous ways. If the country is in the midst of a virulent pandemic, then start talking about "freedom" and whip people into a frenzy against public health measures meant to make everyone safer. Deny poor people access to health insurance simply because you didn't like the president who signed the new law. Pass as many restrictions on the voting rights of Democratic-leaning segments of the population as you can, in order to give your own party an edge. If that's not enough, then install your own partisan zealots to decide which ballots get counted. Allow anyone and everyone to buy and carry around whatever guns they want, without any restrictions whatsoever. Dictate what books are allowed in school libraries. Celebrate intimidation, threats of violence, and outright violence in order to advance your political aims. Censor any ideas you don't agree with or like. If anyone -- even a large corporate donor -- expresses an opinion you don't agree with, pass laws to punish them for their views. Cheat and steal and lie in order to get ahead in politics, and then complain you are being "cancelled" when anyone points it out.
In blue states, none of this is happening. Democrats have been lulled into complacency for decades now, secure in thinking that the long arc of history must surely be bending towards justice. Progress will be made, but sometimes just incrementally or very slowly. We've all just got to be patient, and it'll work out in the end. Don't panic, it's not as bad as it seems. Things'll get better, they always do. We're working on that, give us time. We'll have a white paper out on it soon. Any of this sound familiar?
Democrats let Republicans get away with stealing a seat on the Supreme Court, and they showed nowhere near the outrage and anger that such an outrageous power grab deserved. Now we all will pay the price for that complacency. This was the culmination of 40 or 50 years of Republicans playing a "long game" on judicial appointments. They had an overarching goal, they worked tirelessly for it, and they have finally achieved what they've worked so hard for, for so long. Democrats barely even noticed this battle while it was happening. Republican voters voted with judicial appointments in mind -- Democrats didn't. That's what led us to where we are now.
Of course, Democrats are now expressing shock and outrage, but one wonders how long this will last. Will Democratic politicians fight back with the same intensity that Republicans have long exhibited? Will Democrats hammer the issue home with every chance they get, or will they move on to some focus-group-tested campaign slogan they think will do the trick for them? It's impossible to say, at this point. The red states know full well they are in the midst of a political and legal battle for the future of this country. Democrats are only now slowly waking up to this fact, and there's no guarantee they can be effective in fighting back.
Abortion is at least a very real issue to millions. It is not some abstract legislative concept that is hard to explain or doesn't touch many people's lives. Women in red states -- mostly those without the financial means to travel to blue states -- will now be forced into carrying to term and giving birth, whether they want this to happen or not. Or whether it was the product of rape or incest -- which won't matter. Their freedom and rights are now contingent upon their ZIP code.
The Supreme Court decision today is different in a major way from many of the big decisions America has seen over the past few decades, in that it takes away a right rather than bestowing a new one. This is regressive in the extreme, but the radicals on the court simply don't care. Any rights they don't politically agree with are also going to be fair game from now on. Marriage equality and basic sexual privacy could be next on the chopping block. After all, there was no gay marriage back in the 1800s, right?
The other truly frightening development in American politics is the increasing tendency for Republicans not just to excuse political violence, but to actually embrace it. To many Republicans, an attempted coup -- complete with a mob storming the United States Capitol to prevent Congress from doing its constitutional duty by certifying the results of a presidential election -- was all somehow justified by the fact that they didn't like the outcome of the election. That is frightening, or it should be. Republicans didn't even want an investigation into what happened -- they successfully killed the idea of an independent and nonpartisan commission to look into it. As we heard Tuesday, people's lives have been destroyed by the violence and threats of violence that came out of the 2020 election. And one side still refuses to condemn such violence.
Republicans have gotten to the point where they are now simply fetishizing guns. They pose with them in their campaign ads. They proudly shoot them off to win votes. They even stage little machismo fantasies of "hunting" their political enemies by breaking their doors down and sending in an assault team in their ads now. They send out photos of their whole families -- including very young children -- gleefully brandishing semiautomatic weapons of war. They produce these photos for Christmas -- even though it is hard to even picture any other image that runs so counter to the teachings of Jesus Christ.
Republicans are just fine with creating laws which bring society into their image of what a Christian country should be -- but that's only using their interpretation of the Christian Bible. And they certainly don't hold their own politicians to any noticeable standards of morality, at least not anymore. That's another thing Trump fully exposed. You can do anything and not even bother to admit it or apologize in any way, and as long as you are seen as still being strongly against liberals and liberalism, it's all perfectly fine and dandy. Trump was probably right -- he probably could get away with murder. He could, as he promised, shoot someone on Fifth Avenue, and he wouldn't lose a single supporter. They'd all justify it in one way or another, just like they have justified January 6th.
We are not that far from political violence erupting in much larger ways. The 2024 presidential election could see widespread fighting in the streets before it is over. This is the message the House Select Committee is desperately trying to convey -- this isn't over. January 6th wasn't some one-time event. It was, if anything, a rehearsal for what comes next.
Much of this violence is happening below most people's radar, which is why hearing two women this Tuesday testify how their lives have been destroyed simply because they did their jobs running an American election was so important. Who is going to step up to fairly oversee elections anymore when doing so automatically means death threats to you and your family, demonstrations outside your house, and even home invasions by thugs who want to make "a citizen's arrest" of people who not only broke no law but were just doing their job. These are the people on the frontlines of democracy, but if the price people have to pay to do so is so steep, then the only people who will do so are the ones who are in favor of such "might makes right" tactics in the first place.
Did any Republican express horror after Tuesday's hearing? Did any denounce such tactics? Did any call for new laws to protect such people? Instead, they tacitly approved of it all by their silence. Might doesn't just make right to them, might is also going to decide elections, apparently. Which should frighten every American to their core being.
Maybe seeing Roe get overturned will change things. Maybe a lot more women (and men supportive of women's rights) will get a lot more motivated to vote. Maybe they'll start voting while thinking of judicial appointments, just like the other side does. Maybe the politicians who are stripping away rights as fast as they think they can get away with it will lose power or be voted out. Maybe we'll get enough Democrats in Congress to ignore Kyrsten Sinema and Joe Manchin and actually move the country forward again.
Maybe.
Up until now, for the most part, the Republican agenda was mostly theoretical. Sure, they'd talk about how wonderful life would be if they could just set things up the way they wanted, but for the most part they never actually implemented any of their far-right radical ideas. They'd attempt to at the state level, but then the federal judiciary would rein them in. The Supreme Court was the backstop to all of this, but as is now plain for all to see, that backstop simply doesn't exist anymore.
What would happen if Congress actually did pass an abortion rights law? What if they were successful not only in codifying the protections in Roe but also spelled out the limits of state power on the issue so that states couldn't create hurdle after hurdle for women? Such a bill did indeed already pass the House. So imagine some magical scenario where it passed the Senate as well and was signed into law by Joe Biden. Would it stand? Or would a court case immediately be fast-tracked to the Supreme Court, where such a law would be thrown out as somehow being unconstitutional? That is a very real possibility, even if Democrats were to expand their power in Congress. The radicals on the court wouldn't care -- they'd dictate their own future vision no matter what the people's elected representatives wanted. That is the world we live in now.
Democrats need to bring a fierce urgency to pointing all this out to the voters. They can't simply try to use the abortion issue to get suburban Republican women to cross over and vote for them. They've got to make clear that there's a much bigger issue at stake here -- reforming the Supreme Court. Instituting term limits would be a good place to start. Packing the court is not out of the question. No holds should be barred in this fight, to put this another way. The only way the Supreme Court is going to wake up to just how unpopular their decisions are is if the other branches of government fight back. That's really the only thing that will even get their attention.
Think about it. If the Republicans do manage to create enough chaos during a presidential election to affect the Electoral College results, who is going to decide the outcome? The very same radicals on the Supreme Court who lied under oath about their respect for stare decisis during their Senate confirmation hearings. They will likely have no compunction whatsoever when it comes time to decide who is going to be president -- just like they did in Bush v. Gore, they'll find some reason or another why the Republican must have won.
That is why this is such an urgent matter. The Supreme Court simply has no legitimacy left at all. Mitch McConnell made up a reason out of thin air why the Senate couldn't possibly confirm a justice named by a Democrat, and then turned right around and ignored his made-up logic when it came time to hustle a Republican nominee onto the court right before an election. They'll use every trick in the book, and if that doesn't work they'll throw the book out and just do what they want to anyway.
It's time for Democrats to realize the truth of all of this. If half of American women losing their bodily autonomy doesn't wake them up then nothing ever will. Why not run on a platform of adding four more justices to the Supreme Court? The other side makes up its own rules, why shouldn't we?
Because this isn't going to end with just Roe being overturned. If nothing changes, we'll be living with a very radical court for a very long time. There's no telling what laws they'll throw out next. Anything and everything will be fair game to them. There was no Social Security in the 1800s and there's nothing in the Constitution about it, so who can say whether it will survive or not? And that's just one frightening example. What Republicans have been unable to do legislatively can now be decided by judicial fiat. With absolutely no restraint.
The concept that the only laws which are valid are those with centuries-long pedigrees is absurd, but that's what the court said not only in the abortion case but also in yesterday's opinion which threw out a New York law restricting the ability to walk around with a gun. The New York law that was thrown out was enacted in 1911, but I guess that's not enough historical precedent for the radicals on the court. Any modern law must now pass the "historical tradition" test of today's Supreme Court, which could nullify just about any of the laws or rights Americans rely upon today.
Personally, I don't particularly want to see the country return to the 1800s. I think we've made progress since then. I don't want to see all of this progress deemed insufficiently based in historical precedent. American history is filled with injustice and prejudice and intolerance that few today would want to see us return to. That's what progress is all about, after all.
America is entering a very dark chapter indeed. Hopefully it won't be the last chapter in the "American democracy" book. But the signs don't look especially good, at this point. We are becoming less united by the day, devolving into purely red states and purely blue states. The political chasm which has opened may prove to be unbridgeable. When American citizens cannot travel from one state to another without losing fundamental rights, it's hard to see what "United States" even means anymore. When one of the two major political parties is openly embracing using violence as a political tool, it's hard to be optimistic about the country's future. Obama's line certainly sounded good when he came up with it, but sadly, it seems more and more that Obama was wrong. His optimism has proven to be unfounded.
Will Americans ever unite behind a new president again? It's hard to see that happening any time soon. Will Americans enjoy the same legal protections no matter where they happen to live? No longer. Will the red states and the blue states increasingly chart diametrically-opposed paths for their own citizens? That seems entirely likely. Will we get to a point where life in either color state is vastly different than that of the citizens living in the other color? We are fast approaching that point, as today's decision made clear. "American rights" might become a meaningless term. And that's about as far from Barack Obama's dream of a truly United States as can be imagined.
-- Chris Weigant
Follow Chris on Twitter: @ChrisWeigant
New Rule:
Wild, mind-blowing sex - and even run-of-the-mill sex, for that matter - should be withheld from men who support an outright ban on abortions (the ones who already knew how to give and get it, in the first place) by those women who support a reasonable right to have an abortion.
These sorts of men don't have a monopoly on pleasuring a woman, after all. Ahem. Just think of all the wonderfully pleasurable implications!
If I was an American (W)oman, then I would certainly live in a state of bliss by my new rule!
I wish I could write songs - I'd write lyrics for one called American Man to the music of American Woman by the incomparable Guess Who. A band that SHOULD, by the way, be in the, ah, esteemed(?) Rock and Roll Hall of Fame by now! Heh. That's a little private Canadian joke.
The Guess Who - American Woman (all 14 minutes of it!)
I think we could all use another musical interlude with an apropos selection of timeless Guess Who tunes
Back in 2016 when Merrick Garland was having his nomination ignored, i felt dubious about president Obama's unwillingness to stretch his executive powers and call Congress into special session until either the nominee got a hearing or a law was passed to codify a rule on election year appointments. Mitch McConnell abused his power, and that abuse went unanswered by a response in kind. What exactly did Obama think was going to happen?
This week hasn't surprised me in the least, but it has left me too angry to comment well. I'll say this now, and save more for tomorrow. (CW, I bet we all knew that today would be a rant rather than a normal FTP.)
The whole 1800's thing is nonsense, a canard.
In the early 1800's, the majority of towns in the West banned guns. You had to surrender your weapons when you entered. To give perspective, SCOTUS ruled that the 19th century laws of Tombstone (of Wyatt Earp and the OK Corral fame) and Dodge City, among many others, were unconstitutional.
In 1748, Ben Franklin published his rewrite of "The Instructor." He revised the English book to better fit the needs of the American Colonies. One of his revisions was to include a recipe that induced an abortion.
I've already had to delete and backspace too much just writing this. Read all of you tomorrow.
@speak2,
It is indeed a sad day in history.
When life hands you lemons, what do you do!?
You make a nice lemon meringue pie, that's what!
Come on!
"Snap out of it"!
What movie is that from and who won for best actress?
To me, the most germane quote the dissenting justices:
In Canada, the right to abortion has nothing to do with whether it is a constitutionally protected right. I'm just sayin' ...
@liz,
I can't help but be glum today. In addition to a court decision that will long live in infamy, i lost a student.
https://sunnysidepost.com/15-year-old-boy-in-critical-condition-after-hitting-head-while-surfing-atop-7-train-in-corona
Subway surfing?
Have a double helping of your favourite pie!
And, the pertinent quote is ...
“Riding on top of a subway car is reckless, extremely dangerous and inconsiderate as it causes significant delays for other New Yorkers,” Warren said in a statement.
“Seeking a thrill that promises heartache for family and friends is foolhardy; choose other avenues to have some fun, ones that demonstrate respect for those you care about.”
Sorry, but I'm fresh outta sympathy for people demonstration such idiotic behavior.
Life is too short. Ahem.
Or, maybe I just need to go listen to some more music ...
... or, better yet ... :)
I'm kidding. Sort of.
It's time for Democrats to realize the truth of all of this. If half of American women losing their bodily autonomy doesn't wake them up then nothing ever will. Why not run on a platform of adding four more justices to the Supreme Court? The other side makes up its own rules, why shouldn't we?
Well, I can't really see how Democrats making up their own rules is going to solve anything.
But, if decisions like these on guns and abortion don't light a fire under ALL Americans who believe in freedom and in the ballot to get out there and vote THIS November and next and beyond, then nothing probably will, I would have to agree ...
He was 15. Kids that age are practically hard wired to do stupid stuff.
Fifteen is pretty old, in this day and age.
Besides, there is stupid stuff and then there is stuff like subway surfing.
Death-wish stuff!
Ahhh, bleep Obama. Just like Clinton he was a big money Democrat who did nothing whatsoever to change the results of decades of Republican cult of economic failure.
We have two center-right parties in America. Much of the the rest is culture war distraction. The Repugs are ruthless and the Dems act hapless.
Impeach Thomas and Fratboy. Or pack the Court. Either way the Repugs are not going to be able to hold back the majority of us being disserved by our Constitutional Republic.
EM [12 +]
You are an a-hole!
nypoet: I am really sorry. I was a math teacher at IS 88K in the 1990 academic year (Sunset Park). One of my 8th graders was grabbing a smoke between subway cars (I remember doing that myself). He slipped, it was closed casket.
To this day, I still remember his parents the next day. His father was drunk hard (can't say I blame him), but the pain he felt, and the utter and complete devastation I caught from his mother. Yeah, that's not something I'll forget.
So sorry, nypoet, kids do dumb things and it's heartbreaking when it kills them.
I thought you were done for the night.
Not you! :)
CW, one of the human failings that grieves me most is that some people prefer to go without a good thing than see 'those people' have it too. Access to good health care at reasonable cost? Not if people of colour get it too. Good schools? Not if kids who don't look like mine will go to them. And the same principle often underlies the right-wing resistance to most legislation that would benefit everyone.
And if I am wealthy enough to buy all these things, it goes double. No one else gets it so long as I have mine. I'm a maker (conveniently forgetting all that I was given at birth) and you're a taker, no matter how hard you work at low wages.
It's not just in the US, and the definition of 'those people' varies, of course. It's certainly a big part of the last 10 years of Tory governments in the UK.
@speak & mezzo,
Thank you for the empathy. It's weird being a teacher, even students you're not that close with feel like a part of you, and it cuts deep when tragedy befalls them and their families, as has happened so many times during COVID.
For that matter, lack of empathy underlies quite a lot of the poor decisions people make in this world.
Well, get ready for the epic crime wave of 2039. You heard it here first.
Bashi,
You mean Musk is still trying to get out of the deal? It isn't 5% of users, it's less than 5% of monthly ad clicks are bots. Much more difficult to prove one way or the other and Twitter seems to be intent on holding Musk to the signed offer purchase price..
Elon has always been intent on completing the purchase..
Put it another way...
Let's say you go to buy a car.. You tell the owner, "I'll pay you 44 billion dollars for this car if I can drive it first and you give me all the maintenance records.."
So, you test drive it and you notice things are a bit wanky.. It pulls to the left a bit, there are some funny noises and such..
The owner is reluctant to let you look under the hood and is withholding information about the past maintenance of the car..
So, of course, you are going to be a little wary about completing the deal as offered.. If the car is not as it was portrayed, then you start to think that, while you still want the car, it might not be worth the 44 billion you initially offered..
That is all that is going on with Elon's purchase of Twitter..
All perfectly logical and rational..
OBAMA WAS WRONG
How could I NOT read a commentary with THAT title, eh!?? :D
Barack Obama created many memorable soundbites and campaign slogans, but one of the best-remembered is (as he phrased it in a tweet): "There are no red states or blue states, just the United States." This call for unity in politics was generally well-received, since it spoke to (as another former president once put it) "the better angels of our nature."
It was that sentiment that was the reason why I voted for Obama...
Boy did he sure have me fooled... :(
Fundamental rights can no longer be seen as being protected by our national government.
Baby-killing has not ever been nor will never be ANY kind of "fundamental right".
Even Ruth Bader Ginsburg conceded that the SCOTUS was WAY WRONG to rule as they did in Roe V Wade and Democrat Eugenics v Casey..
Once you accept that one factual premise, everything wrong and disgusting about abortion becomes clear..
According to today's decision, any law which didn't exist back then is fair game to toss out. This is not an exaggeration.
One thing that Obama got right??
"Elections have consequences."
He was smug and arrogant when he stated it..
But he was dead on ballz accurate..
What are the Republican proposals for lowering gas prices? Or inflation? Or improving healthcare? Or racial relations? Or gun violence? Or political violence? They have none. "The other guy's ideas are wrong" is all they feel they need.
Says the representative of the Party whose SOLE PLATFORM these last 6 years or so has been WE HATE TRUMP
Seriously, are you REALLY in a position to complain about the GOP???
Red states are currently in a frenzy of passing laws which either roll back any semblance of modern progress or are designed to use the power of the state to punish their ideological enemies.
Again, considering how utterly immature Democrats were in the President Trump era... The Russia Collusion delusion.. 2 bullshit impeachments.. The CONSTANT 24/7 persecution of President Trump...
Are you REALLY in a position to complain??
And, I will also point out that, once the GOP take over Congress in the coming Red Tsunami.... You ain't seen NUTTIN' yet!!
The Supreme Court decision today is different in a major way from many of the big decisions America has seen over the past few decades, in that it takes away a right rather than bestowing a new one. This is regressive in the extreme, but the radicals on the court simply don't care. Any rights they don't politically agree with are also going to be fair game from now on. Marriage equality and basic sexual privacy could be next on the chopping block. After all, there was no gay marriage back in the 1800s, right?
All that will happen, if it indeed DOES happen, is that those rights will not be deemed CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS..
If what you claim does come to pass, those "rights" will be simply returned to the people and the PEOPLE will decided..
What is wrong with that??
Abortion hasn't been made ILLEGAL... The right to kill your baby has simply been returned to the STATES so that THE PEOPLE can decide how they want to live their lives..
Do they want to be civilized and respect the sanctity of life, like in red states??
Or do they want to live in blue states where every woman can be a Casey Anthony??
I fail to see the problem here??
The People *SHOULD* decided. Don't you agree???
That is why this is such an urgent matter. The Supreme Court simply has no legitimacy left at all. Mitch McConnell made up a reason out of thin air why the Senate couldn't possibly confirm a justice named by a Democrat, and then turned right around and ignored his made-up logic when it came time to hustle a Republican nominee onto the court right before an election. They'll use every trick in the book, and if that doesn't work they'll throw the book out and just do what they want to anyway.
A helluva gambit that I bet no one was more surprised that it worked than Mitch McConnell himself..
And yunno what?? I bet, at the time, that Team Hillary was THRILLED that Mitch pulled that stunt.. I bet Hillary LOVED the idea of her first job upon being elected was that she would get a SCOTUS pick..
But Hillary forgot one very important point.. She forgot that she would have to WORK to get the election win..
She was already measuring the drapes for the Oval Office and forgot she actually had to campaign..
And here we are...
Look... Democrats lost... That is all there is to it...
Considering the track record of the Biden's Handlers Administration to date, I would have thought that ya'all were USED to losing by now...
And I get it.. It was a big loss... I can understand how ya'all feel..
But the simple fact is, Roe V Wade and Democrat Eugenics V Casey NEVER should have been decided as it was..
This is well-documented FACT that even vaunted DEMOCRAT scholars like RBG has stated as fact..
So, all today's SCOTUS did was right that VERY egregious wrong..
"The arc of history is long, but it does bend towards justice"
-Dr Martin Luther King
RvW and DEvC was egregiously decided.. It took 50 years...
But justice has now been served.
"Everything is as it once was"
-The Guardian Of Forever
JL, Liz
JL, I do understand your sorrow and I hope that the child pulls thru OK.. I won't bother with the prayers thing because I am not religious at all..
And while I do think that Liz could have been a bit more sympathetic, she does raise a good point.
And while I do hesitate to interject politics into this tragedy...
Yunno what... Never mind..
Hopefully the young tyke will pull through and then I can pontificate...
But not now..
JL,
Well, get ready for the epic crime wave of 2039. You heard it here first.
You mentioned that before..
What's your reasoning for that particular date???
MC,
Impeach Thomas and Fratboy. Or pack the Court. Either way the Repugs are not going to be able to hold back the majority of us being disserved by our Constitutional Republic.
Neither is going to happen..
FDR tried it and he had a LOT more going for him than Biden's Handlers and even FDR failed..
It's just NOT going to happen..
But once again, you demonstrate the Dem knack for short-term thinking without considering consequences..
Let's say that Dems DO get to pack the SCOTUS.. They add 5 justices, make them all DEM Justices so the SCOTUS is now 8-6 in favor of Dem..
Then what happens when the GOP gets back into power, as you KNOW will happen...
The GOP adds TEN Justices, so now the SCOTUS is 16-8 in favor of Conservatives..
How long do you think it would take for an entire 3rd of our government (the Judicial) to be totally and utterly destroyed???
Beyond the blatant hypocrisy, this is most likely the BIGGEST character flaw of the Democrat Party..
They are all about the short-term fix and NEVER consider the consequences of their actions..
Nay, Roe v Wade and Democrat Eugenics v Casey being thrown on the trash heap of history where it belongs??
That happened as a ***DIRECT RESULT*** of Democrat short-term-fix-ignore-long-term-consequences thinking..
If you people are searching around for someone to blame for losing RvW and DEvC???
You need look no further than your own Democrat Party...
:eyeroll:
How long do you think it would take for an entire 3rd of our government (the Judicial) to be totally and utterly destroyed???
Speaking of destroying a branch of government..
There was an insurrection last night in the Arizona Capitol... Hostages were taken by Democrat rioters..
Will we see any condemnation of that by Weigantians??
I am betting we won't... Not in the slightest...
Because insurrection is perfectly acceptable to Democrats.. When it is against the RIGHT people for the "RIGHT" reasons..
:eyeroll:
"Protesters threatened to break the AZ Senate entryway glass. We are currently there being held hostage inside the Senate building due to members of the public trying to breach our security. We smell tear gas and the children of one of the members are in the office sobbing with fear.
I expect a J24 committee to be created immediately."
-Republican Arizona State Senator Wendy Rogers
Democrats are fine with political violence when it's DEMOCRATS who are committing the violence and attacking the RIGHT people..
Hypocrisy.. It's not a bug in Democrat programming.. It's a feature..
Reposted for clarity...
"Protesters threatened to break the AZ Senate entryway glass. We are currently there being held hostage inside the Senate building due to members of the public trying to breach our security. We smell tear gas and the children of one of the members are in the office sobbing with fear.
I expect a J24 committee to be created immediately."
-Republican Arizona State Senator Wendy Rogers
Democrats are fine with political violence when it's DEMOCRATS who are committing the violence and attacking the RIGHT people..
Hypocrisy.. It's not a bug in Democrat programming.. It's a feature..
If ya'all want a map to chart where this is all heading??
I suggest the Kelly Turnball THE PEOPLE'S REPUBLIC series....
It's an eye-opener...
Speak2
In the early 1800's, the majority of towns in the West banned guns. You had to surrender your weapons when you entered. To give perspective, SCOTUS ruled that the 19th century laws of Tombstone (of Wyatt Earp and the OK Corral fame) and Dodge City, among many others, were unconstitutional.
In 1748, Ben Franklin published his rewrite of "The Instructor." He revised the English book to better fit the needs of the American Colonies. One of his revisions was to include a recipe that induced an abortion.
You are comparing apples and alligators..
In the old days you are describing, towns were more like corporate entities today...
And yes, you can find isolated areas where abortion was perfectly acceptable.. Other areas, like Arizona, abortion was flat out illegal with jail time for those who had them or did them..
Which is JUST like it is today...
So, what's yer problem???
Today, there will be areas where baby killing is cherished and something to be PROUD of..
Democrat states..
And there will be areas where baby killing is flat out illegal.. Civilized states..
Red states...
What's yer beef???
One thing that should be noted for those who claim that the SCOTUS is political..
The fact that the opinion didn't change one iota from the leaked version proves that the SCOTUS doesn't bow to political pressure...
"We end this opinion where we began. Abortion presents a profound moral question. The Constitution does not prohibit the citizens of each State from regulating or prohibiting abortion. Roe and Casey arrogated that authority. We now overrule those decisions and return that authority to the people and their elected representatives.”
-Justice Alito
I'll ask all of ya'all the same question I asked Speak2..
Where's the beef???
It's been WELL ESTABLISHED as fact that no where in the US Constitution is there ANY mention of abortion..
Therefore, it is an issue best left up to the states, so the PEOPLE can decide what kind of society they want thru the representatives the PEOPLE elect..
That's what DEMOCRACY is...
Do ya'all have a problem with DEMOCRACY???
Or are Democrats just pissy because they cannot impose their will on people who don't agree with Democrats???
And just think..
This ALL could have been avoided if Democrats had just been happy with Safe, legal and rare baby killing..
But noo.....
Once again, Democrats had to push and push for short term glory, totally ignoring the long-term consequences..
And here we are...
Once again, Democrats...
If you want to look for someone to blame for this??
Just look in the mirror...
Speak2 wrote:
EM[12 +]
You are an a-hole!
Well, that's a first. In all these years of shit-disturbing, I've never been called a asshole before - at least, not than I can remember. :) While it's not the greatest note to go out on, it did knock some sense into me, or something.
It's time for Democrats to realize the truth of all of this. If half of American women losing their bodily autonomy doesn't wake them up then nothing ever will. Why not run on a platform of adding four more justices to the Supreme Court? The other side makes up its own rules, why shouldn't we?
I'll point out the same scenario in response to this that I pointed out to MC..
So Democrats add 4 Justices right now..
It won't be enough to save the mid terms or 2024, so the GOP owns the government and they add 10 justices...
Now what???
If Democrats REALLY want an insurrection against the judiciary, then by all means... Pack the court..
But Democrats will simply be proving beyond ANY doubt that it's the Democrat Party that is the Insurrection Party....
But, of course, no matter.. Democrats are all about the short term fix and to hell with the consequences...
That's the Democrat Party in a nutshell...
:eyeroll:
Liz,
For the record, I believe that was uncalled for..
Your empathy left a bit to be desired..
But I don't think it went as far as a-hole'ness..
Just my 2 cents... :D
Jean Luc,
Kids that age are practically hard wired to do stupid stuff.
Just so ya know... That's gonna come back and bite you on the arse at some future date..
Ya got to know that, right??
"With this decision, the conservative majority of the Supreme Court shows how extreme it is, how far removed they are from the majority of this country.
They have made the United States an outlier among developed nations in the world."
-Joe Biden
Not factually accurate..
Most civilized countries ban abortions at some point during the pregnancy..
Iran and North Korea are 2 countries that allow unlimited abortion on demand..
Great company the Democrat Party keeps, eh? :eyeroll:
Abortion ruling: NC pregnancy center recounts attack from violent abortionist group Jane's Revenge
Rep. Markwayne Mullin, R-Okla, called the group 'domestic terrorists' and urged DHS action.
And the condemnation from Democrats and Weigantians??
{{{cccchhhhiiiirrrrrppppp}}}{{ccchhhirrrrpppp}}
I am betting ya'all are going to have a LOT of opportunities to condemn political violence from Democrats in the coming days and weeks..
The only question is...
Will Democrats practice what they preach???
I am betting... NO...
And.... break time.. :D
Joshua,
For that matter, lack of empathy underlies quite a lot of the poor decisions people make in this world.
Couldn't agree more. In the final analysis, it's what leads to stupid wars.
For that matter, lack of empathy underlies quite a lot of the poor decisions people make in this world.
Yep..
Like the lack of empathy Democrats are guilty of when it comes to President Trump and his supporters..
"I trusted Justice Gorsuch and Justice Kavanaugh when they testified under oath that they also believed Roe v. Wade was settled legal precedent and I am alarmed they chose to reject the stability the ruling has provided for two generations of Americans."
-Joe Manchin
Plessy v Ferguson was ALSO "settled legal precedent"..
Is Manchin saying that it should not have been over-ruled by the SCOTUS???
Precedents are legally settled... Until they're not...
It's how the Judiciary works...
"The Roe decision is important precedent of the Supreme Court that has been reaffirmed many times."
-Justice Kavanaugh
Factual statement.. Justice Kavanaugh's current decision does nothing to question the factual nature of his previous confirmation hearing statement..
"A good judge will consider it as precedent of the U.S. Supreme Court."
-Justice Gorsuch
Again, a factual statement that is not lessened by Justice Gorsuch's current actions..
If things happen they way Democrats claim they should happen, then Plessy V Ferguson would still be the law of the land..
Bad precedents are set.. They must be overruled..
Where's the beef here???
“How about those justices coming before the senators and saying that they respected stare decisis, the precedent of the court. That they respected the right of privacy in the Constitution of the United States. Did you hear that? Were they not telling the truth then?”
-House Speaker Nancy Pelosi
Dred Scott decision, formally Dred Scott v. John F.A. Sandford, legal case in which the U.S. Supreme Court on March 6, 1857, ruled (7–2) that a slave (Dred Scott) who had resided in a free state and territory (where slavery was prohibited) was not thereby entitled to his freedom; that African Americans were not and could never be citizens of the United States; and that the Missouri Compromise (1820), which had declared free all territories west of Missouri and north of latitude 36°30?, was unconstitutional. The decision added fuel to the sectional controversy and pushed the country closer to civil war.
Sooo...
Pelosi is saying that Dred Scott should be the law of the land??
Pelosi is saying that Plessy v Ferguson should be the law of the land??
Is THAT what Pelosi and the Democrats are saying???
The Stare Decisis argument is a bullshit argument that no rational person should make..
It's an ignorant argument... Period.. Full Stop...
Finland
Poland
Great Britain
Andorra
Lichtenstein
Malta
Monaco
San Marino
All these European countries do not allow elective baby killing at all..
Out of 42 European countries that DO allow elective baby killing only The Netherlands is as permissible as the Democrat Party's.. IE Baby Killing on demand right up to the point of birth..
So, can we please stop with this BS that the US is an outlier on stopping baby killing??
It is the Democrat Party's position on baby killing that is the outlier...
Democrat Party, Iran, North Korea..
They all have the same policy on Baby Killing...
Correction..
The Netherlands allows baby killing up to the 24th week..
There is NO European country that allows what Democrats want..
Unrestricted on demand baby killing right up to the point of birth..
So, the Democrat Party truly is the outlier...
Roe V Wade was bad law from the start and it was bad law that was destined to be over-ruled..
Destiny is now fulfilled...
To quote THANOS who we all know is a Democrat...
"I am... inevitable.."
RvW being over-ruled was inevitable..
RGB tried to warn Democrats.. She was ignored..
You almost have to feel sorry for Roberts..
He was so determined to try and please everyone he ended up, as is usual when people try to play both sides, to put it kindly (or talk out both sides of their ass to put it unkindly), pleasing no one..
Roberts efforts to kick the can down the road was destined to fail..
Much like Roe itself..
I do agree with the moderator on one point..
Roberts has lost control of his court...
The conservatives are fully and unequivocally in control..
That's always been the problem with the SCOTUS..
They were more concerned with IMPACT and less concerned with doing what is RIGHT.. What is CONSTITUTIONAL..
It's refreshing to get not only ONE but TWO decisions that lays down the law, succinctly and unequivocally and to hell with namby pamby feelings..
It's like a breath of fresh air...
EM [45]
I was done commenting for the evening, but still went back and read some comments. I saw your replies to nypoet and was appalled; what nypoet needed was a simple hug.
Going further, while everyone has the "right" to comment, sometimes, maybe we shouldn't.
If you have never grown up, worked in, or lived in a neighborhood that might be described as a barrio, ghetto, or housing project in a place like NYC, Chicago, or LA, then you have no clue and anything like self-righteous indignation is inappropriate.
These kids have no hope. That is how they see life while growing up. They see those who work hard and are good people. Those people die in the hellhole that is life. Old age or an [expletive deleted] with a badge or track marks.
Same for those who take education seriously (since the kids don't see the ones who get out).
A kid who's not beyond good on the court or field sees no way out.
They look, and the only ones living large are pushing poison (from the top, street hustlers still die in hell) while amassing money, women, nice things.
To escape, you need to stand out. I left NYC 30 yrs ago and subway surfing wasn't a thing then. But, I can see how the progression and the need to make and do the next thing can lead to that one.
Try a breath of fresh smog.
Allowing state legislators free rein to decide on an individual's right to control her own body is neither right nor constitutional. It's no less abhorrent than allowing a perfectly healthy woman to abort a perfectly healthy fetus at 36 weeks.
We need a consensus compromise, not each side contending to impose their will on the other.
@speak,
Thank you so much. I didn't have it in me to reply so I appreciate that you did
Speak2
Re: 63..
It's that kind of "just kids being kids" attitude is why crap like this continues to happen..
MUCH better to call a spade and spade in order to de-glorify such behavior..
Allowing state legislators free rein to decide on an individual's right to control her own body is neither right nor constitutional.
As has been pointed out and factually supported.
It's not the woman's body.. It's a sentient human's body and IT deserves the right to life..
It's that simple..
We need a consensus compromise
We have a consensus compromise..
Blue state women can be Casey Anthony all day long and kill all the babies they want..
CIVILIZED women in red states can love and nurture their babies..
The most effective compromise on the planet..
We have a consensus compromise..<
I don't think you quite understand what those words mean
Jean Luc,
Don't get me wrong.. I am all for the kind of compromise that you are talking about..
Set a date (6 weeks, 15 weeks, etc etc) where the ability to abort a baby and everyone would be happy... Keep abortion SAFE, LEGAL and RARE..
But Democrats didn't WANT a compromise..
They wanted everything THEIR way.. So they pushed and pushed and pushed and NOW Democrats have nothing...
Democrats are they architects of Roe v Wade's and Democrat Eugenics v Casey's demise..
Democrats have NO ONE to blame but themselves..
"afw'ein Mnhei'sahe"
-Romulan Proverb
Roughly translated to the Latin term "sans humanite" which means, "I will give them no pity, they deserve no mercy and it serves them right!"
I don't think you quite understand what those words mean
You're right.. I should have said we have a compromise..
Democrats forfeited their right to consensus when they decided baby killing had to be their way and their way only..
Now all Democrats are left with is the highway...
"Hit the road Jack.. And don'tcha come back no more no more no more.. Hit the road Jack.. And don'tcha come back no more..."
By the bi..
I informed my lovely wife that we have a homework assignment to complete tonight.. She's all in.. :D
[45]
[62]
Yes, Elizabeth. Pay attention to these. You've been on the surly side since Russia invaded Ukraine. You've also put effort into "reaching" our troll. Not working out so well, if you haven't noticed? You sure haven't figured it out.
Yes, Elizabeth. Pay attention to these. You've been on the surly side since Russia invaded Ukraine. You've also put effort into "reaching" our troll. Not working out so well, if you haven't noticed? You sure haven't figured it out.
It's actually working out quite well..
Despite your insistence on childish name calling and immature personal attacks... :eyeroll:
Something I had THOUGHT you grew out of...
Guess I was wrong...
Babies are born.
Scientifically speaking, babies are conceived..
But I get it..
Democrats must de-humanize victims so the brutal butchering of the victims is clinically acceptable...
Just keep in mind..
It's universally accepted in Weigantia that there SHOULD be restrictions on baby killing..
This is fact...
“We cannot exceed the scope of our authority under the Constitution, and we cannot allow our decisions to be affected by any extraneous influences such as concern about the public’s reaction to our work. That is true both when we initially decide a constitutional issue and when we consider whether to overrule a prior decision.”
-Justice Alito
Word...
Roe and Casey were wrongly adjudicated.. This has been acknowledged by HUNDREDS of Constitutional Scholars many of which are Democrats including the notorious RBG...
We must applaud the SCOTUS that had the courage to right this egregious wrong..
"We cannot embrace a narrow ground of decision simply because it is narrow; it must also be right."
-Chief Justice Roberts
Allowing state legislators free rein to decide on an individual's right to control her own body is neither right nor constitutional.
On the one hand, you have the woman's right to control her body.. She exercised that right when she participated in an activity that could result in pregnancy..
On the other hand, we have the life of a child...
Once that child has been conceived, the child's right to life supersedes the rights of the woman to kill that child..
When you look at things logically and rationally, it's quite simple..
But when Democrats start changing "woman" to "birthing person", it proves beyond ANY doubt that Democrats are far far FAR outside the realm of logic and rationality...
M [66]
I did not say anything like "kids being kids." I was not making "apologies" for anyone.
I was discussing what it's like growing up without hope. That's not all kids and it's not kids being kids. It's kids in a very specific situation seeing only one way out and attempting to seize it, for better or worse (almost always for worse).
I'm willing to bet that few who are political wonks or geeks (like us) have any idea what that's like.
It's very different.
If you have no experience, you can't really understand it. If you're human, you should have some compassion for kids in such conditions, whether you understand it or not.
Scientifically speaking, babies are conceived..
No. And lets see you back that up with real science. Real science should pass what ever half assed excuse you have for not backing up your drivel...
It's universally accepted in Weigantia that there SHOULD be restrictions on baby killing..
This is fact...
No it's not a "fact". Baby killing should be absolutely banned and is against the law. Abortion on the other hand...only in primitive states that are too cheap to deal with their problems so foist them on others...
Bashi,
Baby Killing = Abortion
Regardless of how you want to say it, the simple fact is EVERY Weigantian that weighed in agrees that there should be SOME restrictions on baby killing/abortion.
This is fact..
Speak2
I was discussing what it's like growing up without hope. That's not all kids and it's not kids being kids. It's kids in a very specific situation seeing only one way out and attempting to seize it, for better or worse (almost always for worse).
There are no facts to support the claim that this kid was "growing up without hope"..
Further, even if he was, that simply cannot be ANY valid excuse for the actions that he took..
Unless you are claiming that this wasn't a thrill seek but rather a suicide attempt..
If you are, then that is a whole 'nother discussion..
@m,
No matter how many times you repeat your opinion on fetuses being equal to babies, it will still be a minority opinion, not a fact.
Living organisms, yes. Babies, not so much.
I'm also fairly certain you already know that, and are insisting otherwise just to be provocative.
No matter how many times you repeat your opinion on fetuses being equal to babies, it will still be a minority opinion, not a fact.
Maybe a minority opinion here..
But still 1000% factual...
Ya'all have conceded as much by agreeing there should be restrictions on abortion..
It's also interesting to note that not a single condemnation of the attempted insurrection and the hostage taking at the AZ state capitol..
Not surprising..
But interesting.
Simply proves the point that Democrats don't mind political violence.. As long as it's Democrat violence against the Right...
Also interesting to note that it took throwing Roe v Wade and Democrat Eugenics v Casey being thrown on the trash heap of history to take the Cardassian Show trial that is the 6JC off the front page of Democrat concerns.. :D
President Trump, A Formidable Candidate In 2024 Republican Primaries: Golden/TIPP Poll
Trump still holds sway over a sizeable section of the Republican Party and has the support of millions of American voters – a fact that drives Democrats to tear him down.
President Trump has Democrats totally and completely petrified... :D
Ya'all have conceded as much by agreeing there should be restrictions on abortion...
No, i have conceded no such thing. i believe the 30% minority who hold that opinion should be respected by imposing reasonable restrictions that do not place an onerous burden on women with unwanted pregnancies.
Baby Killing = Abortion
Nope. And I see you can't back up your "1000% fact". Guess that means it's a 1000% lie...
The only reason for the 6JC to exist..
Bringing down President Trump..
No, i have conceded no such thing.
OK, so we have to go thru this again..
Fine....
Do you support unrestricted abortion up to the point of birth??
Yes or no???
It's also interesting to note that not a single condemnation of the attempted insurrection and the hostage taking at the AZ state capitol..
You mean your non-story that does not seem to be in any normal news but evidently some right wing rag too wacky for even you to link to?
According to the Arizona and Phoenix redits, backed up by video, it was a chill protest with families and kids. Some banging on the windows by a small group, nothing broken and the police over reacted and tear gassed kids...
Simply proves the point that Trumpers don't mind political violence.. As long as it's tear gas against families and kids...
The only reason for the 6JC to exist..
Bringing down President Trump..
Nope. But it is side benefit.
According to the Arizona and Phoenix redits, backed up by video, it was a chill protest with families and kids. Some banging on the windows by a small group, nothing broken and the police over reacted and tear gassed kids...
Of course you would say that.. In your eyes Democrat political violence is NEVER real violence..
Thank you for proving my point for me..
Yawn.
I accept your concession.. :D
"But what I’m asking you, sir, is, do you want to see the court overturn—you just said you want to see the court protect the Second Amendment. Do you want to see the court overturn Roe v. Wade?"
"Well, if we put another two or perhaps three justices on, that’s really what’s going to be—that will happen. And that’ll happen automatically, in my opinion, because I am putting pro-life justices on the court. I will say this: It will go back to the states, and the states will then make a determination."
Chris Wallace/Donald Trump
Presidential Debates 2016
President Trump did what he said he would do...
An amazing talent in a President... :D
As I've said before, i really don't know at what point I believe the organism ceases to be a collection of related cells and starts to be an infant, presuming that such a point even exists in any objective sense. If my beliefs were the only ones that counted i'd use the viability standard, because it seems to me like a rational compromise between the two sides of the debate.
[75]
It's universally accepted in Weigantia that there SHOULD be restrictions on baby killing..
This is fact...
Once again you are putting words in people's mouths to attract attention.
I do NOT agree that there should be ANY restrictions on abortion whatsoever! For in reality that solves a problem that doesn't exist.
Just because you believe that women wait until the last minute to get an abortion has nothing to do with the real world. And because you believe Democratic want the right to kill their babies AFTER birth just kills your credibility. Full stop.
But despite being shredded on a regular basis you CLEARLU don't care how you look. Just so long as you're "owning" the Libs.
[99]
If my beliefs were the only ones that counted i'd use the viability standard, because it seems to me like a rational compromise between the two sides of the debate.
Trouble is what willingness for rational compromise and for that matter rational debate do you see from the right-wing? If you haven't noticed, @m's daily nonsense proves that that these Christofacists are not remotely interested in such things.
In fact, Supreme Thomas saw fit to write that marriage equality, contraception and interracial marriage rights are next.
You can't talk to these people -- they're just too whacko.
As I've said before, i really don't know at what point I believe the organism ceases to be a collection of related cells and starts to be an infant, presuming that such a point even exists in any objective sense. If my beliefs were the only ones that counted i'd use the viability standard, because it seems to me like a rational compromise between the two sides of the debate.
So, is that a YES or a NO about supporting unrestricted abortion right up to the point up birth??
MC,
I do NOT agree that there should be ANY restrictions on abortion whatsoever!
So, you support killing a baby right up to the point of birth??
Disgusting...
Just because you believe that women wait until the last minute to get an abortion has nothing to do with the real world.
The fact that THAT is exactly what Democrats are fighting for is exactly the point..
In fact, Supreme Thomas saw fit to write that marriage equality, contraception and interracial marriage rights are next.
Not factually accurate..
What Justice Thomas said is that those "rights" were wrongly attributed as Constitutional rights.. Just as baby killing was..
And Justice Thomas is dead on ballz accurate in that assessment..
Ya lost, MC...
Accept it and move on...
Betty Bowers explains that Life is Precious. (5:05)
Just to clear things up.
So, is that a YES or a NO about supporting unrestricted abortion right up to the point up birth??
It really is a simple YES or NO question..
The fact that you are unwilling to answer it proves the validity of my point..
NO SANE person would answer YES to that question..
It's obvious to any CIVILIZED person that the answer is NO..
NO person with ANY semblance of civility would support unrestricted baby killing up to the point of birth..
Any Weigantian would HAVE to answer NO.. They don't support unrestricted abortion right up to the point of birth..
Ergo.. Every Weigantian supports abortion restrictions... The ONLY point of contention is WHERE those restrictions are placed...
QED
Which is exactly what JL said in comment #99...
JL,
If my beliefs were the only ones that counted i'd use the viability standard,
Which is EXACTLY the standard that Chief Justice Roberts stated for the record should be thrown out..
INSURRECTION IN ARIZONE
https://www.azdps.gov/news/ims/85
Response from Weigantians???
{{ccchhiiiirrrrrpppp}}{{cchiiiirrrrppp}}
So, we can put to rest as false the idea that Weigantians will condemn DEMOCRAT political violence...
That's been settled... :eyeroll:
When do Democrats convene the J24C hearings???
Answer: NEVER
:eyeroll:
https://a57.foxnews.com/static.foxnews.com/foxnews.com/content/uploads/2022/06/918/516/06-Trump-Did-SM-1080.jpg?ve=1&tl=1
HUZZZAH!!!
Guess what Hawaii??? You have just become a SHALL.MUST ISSUE state...
Welcome to the Constitutional Republic of the United States Of America...
Aloha...
OK It's time for my homework assignment..
See ya'all in the AM... :D
Speak2,
I left NYC 30 yrs ago and subway surfing wasn't a thing then.
It sure shootin' shouldn't be a thing today, either! If you care about kids, that is.
I didn't grow up in the projects or even in public housing but pretty damn close. As it is today, I live pretty much paycheck to paycheck with a little retirement savings though I'll be working till I die. So, I really don't need you or anyone else to explain what empathy and compassion are. Especially when you don't think subway surfing needs to end!
I felt bad this morning. Feel worse now. Aloha!
@liz,
i have no desire to make you feel bad or hit you over the head with it, but it really was horribly insensitive. this is a kid that was sitting in my class taking a final exam a week ago, and now he's lying unconscious in a hospital bed, unlikely to ever wake up. his girlfriend came by my class every morning to give him a hug. yes, subway surfing is horrible, as if i needed any additional convincing. i sincerely hope the next kid who decides to do something stupid chooses something less lethal.
Maybe if people would get as angry as I am about this then another kid won't suffer the same fate and put his loved ones through Hell!!
No one here can make me feel bad. Only I can do that.
And, why on God's green earth do I need to come to place that makes me do that?
No fucking reason at all!
After 15 years, you'd think people would basically know who you are and where you're coming from and what pushes your buttons.
Well, regardless, here's a much better note to end on for this sensitive soul. Heh. Thanks, Joshua!
Jann Arden - Insensitive
https://youtu.be/Ui89HtM7D54
in the air tonight, live acoustic
Oh, very nice. Music makes everything better.
Wow, I thought I was done with this one, but here we are.
Trying to explain an action and coming up with motivations provide reasons. Those don't excuse actions. Reasons and excuses are different beasts. That was for M.
For EM
I never said subway surfing doesn't need to end.
I'm not happy with people not reading carefully or twisting words and meanings for their own purposes or agendas. Please try harder.
For nypoet
I hesitated. My usual response to your thanks would be "my pleasure," but that felt inappropriate.
Best I can do from there is "Peace."
S
Reasons and excuses are different beasts.
Perhaps... But they strive to achieve the same goal...
To mitigate, equivocate and/or justify actions..
It's like how Democrats ignore political violence from the Democrats..
They give "reasons" or "excuses" for the violence.
"It's not really violence"
or, the most popular...
"well...er. uh... THAT'S different"
Democrats live in a dream world and their reasons/excuses are constantly changing so Democrats DON'T have to change who they are and what they do..
OK so we watched SHAWSHANK REDEMPTION....
It was a good movie.. But I felt like when I watched 2001: A SPACE ODYSSEY
It was decent but we didn't get why it's an American classic...
Perhaps if we had watched it in it's hey day it would have made more of an impact..
But it was good... We enjoyed it..
After 15 years, you'd think people would basically know who you are and where you're coming from and what pushes your buttons.
Ahhh but there is always something new to learn.. :D
Speaking of mitigating, equivocating and justifying...
‘DEATH TO SCOTUS’
Portland rioters smash windows, tag private property with pro-choice messages in city’s downtown
More Democrat violence that will go un-condemned..
One has to wonder when Democrats will convene the J25C to investigate THIS violence... :^/
Looks like Summer 2022 is shaping up to be worse than Summer 2020....
So, don't worry Democrats.. Ya'all will have PLENTY of chances to ignore Democrat violence... :eyeroll:
We need to face reality here.. The SCOTUS over-turning RvW and DEvC was not judicial activism..
It was the solution to judicial activism. It rectified and corrected the gross and perverse judicial activism of 5 decades ago..
And yes.. As mentioned by Justice Thomas, there are several instances of judicial activism that ALSO may need rectifying.. Time will tell if those instances will also be rectified..
If that comes to pass, then those instances will be returned to the people so that the PEOPLE, thru their elected representatives, can decide how they want their lives to be...
That's what Democracy is all about... Why are ya'all so afraid of Democracy??? Why are Democrats so intent on forcing THEIR will on people who don't share Democrat beliefs??
That's not Democracy.. That's authoritarianism.. Dictatorship.. Why are Democrats so intent on being a dictatorship???
Someone (I think it was Russ) asked me before to put the 2nd Amendment in place of Roe v Wade and Democrat Eugenics v Casey...
It could never happen, because it's an apple v eskimo comparison, but in the spirit of the question asked, I will answer..
(As an aside, it would be nice if others could emulate my integrity.. But k sara sara)
IF some future SCOTUS were able to judicial activism the 2nd away and return the power of the right to keep and bear arms to the states (which is ALL that this current SCOTUS has done with RvW and DEvC) I would be bummed.. But I live in a state where the right to keep and bear arms is sacrosanct, so it would not be any big deal for me..
If I lived in a Democrat state, I would simply move to a state that IS a Conceal Carry state. That is how important the right to defend myself and my family is to me..
Since it's obvious that the right to kill babies is that important to Democrats, they can simply move to a state where the right to kill babies is sacrosanct..
So, everyone is happy... It's a win win for ALL Americans..
Call me insensitive, but I honestly don't understand what all the fuss is about?? People who STILL want to kill their babies will be able to kill their babies.. They will simply have to move to a state where there are like-minded WE LOVE KILLING BABIES people..
I'll ask AGAIN....
Where's the beef???
As per Bashi's request..
Colorado pregnancy center vandalized, set ablaze hours after Supreme Court announced abortion decision: police
The Supreme Court announced it was overturning the landmark Roe v. Wade abortion case on Friday
https://a57.foxnews.com/static.foxnews.com/foxnews.com/content/uploads/2022/06/720/405/290150647_399045722265850_981544913482531780_n.jpg?ve=1&tl=1
Context provided... :^/
The Elysian Kingdom
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt14426856/?ref_=ttep_ep8
What started out as one of the WORST episodes turned into one of the BEST episodes..
And, as a bonus, they got rid of Captain Pike's Johnny Bravo jiffy-pop doo.... :D
The lonely chief: How John Roberts lost control of the court
The chief justice had zero support for his middle of the road effort on Roe v. Wade.
Ya almost have to feel sorry for Roberts..
But I temper that pity with the fact that Roberts is being a politician where a judge and a leader are called for..
When it comes to moral issues such as baby killing, the politician needs to step down and the judge/leader needs to step up...
Gov. DeSantis continues promoting permitless carry following SCOTUS ruling
I have to admit that I am of two minds on this..
I am sure ya'all realize that I am a Constitutional Carry type person..
But the cop in me sees the inherent danger in NOT having a permit system in place... To allow permit-less carry is fraught with dangers...
So this issue is really a moral conundrum for me...
Simply one more indication that Democrats are all about the short term...
The Democrat Party simply has NO CONCEPT of long term strategic thinking...
“We have an election coming up in November, and we need to elect pro-choice Democrats who are going to protect abortion rights, and give us the ability to pass legislation to protect those rights across this country. That’s the easiest and simplest path forward, and that’s what I would ask everybody to understand and get behind.”
-Democrat Sen. Catherine Cortez Masto
And THAT is exactly the problem with the Democrat Party..
They are ALWAYS about the easiest and simplest way...
Democrats are not interested in doing the hard work and heavy lifting to push their agenda..
Democrats believe that the world owes them... Democrats believe that they are entitled.... So Democrats won't do the hard work and heavy lifting..
Allow me to give the Democrats a list of what they are entitled to... A list of what society owes them...
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
That's it..
That is ALL Democrats are entitled to... That is ALL that society owes to Democrats...
Meanwhile, Disney’s much-touted “Lightyear” came out and did surprisingly poorly after a lot of week-of-release talk about the lesbian relationship in the film. The same-sex marriage is a small part of the story and no one should be bothered by the existence of gay people, even in a kids’ movie, but the shocking underperformance must have Disney wondering whether people stayed away because they thought (even if mistakenly) that “Lightyear” was a message movie.
Disney’s decision to spend a couple of minutes of screen time reminding us that it’s a gay-friendly company may well have cost it millions in ticket sales for what was supposed to be its annual Pixar mega-blockbuster. Disney has to consider the idea that there might be many Pixar fans who have no problem with gay marriage who nevertheless would prefer the matter be left out of kids’ movies. Disney also chose a side in the Florida dispute about teaching sexual orientation to little kids, and it may have damaged one of the world’s most valuable brands.
Lightyear WAS a "message movie"... When they replaced the REAL Buzz Lightyear with a liberal, Disney sent a perfectly clear message...
GO WOKE.... GO BROKE....
The message couldn't be ANY clearer...
"The overturning of Roe is the direct result of decades of strategy to strip women of reproductive healthcare and full autonomy over our bodies.
As governor, I will veto any anti-choice legislation and work to roll back existing anti-choice legislation."
-BIG LIE Advocate Stacey Abrams
And yet, Abrams can't even define what a "woman" is...
Funny how that is, eh?? :D
And how do Democrats propose "IMPOSING" anything on the Judiciary which is an EQUAL branch to the Legislative???
Democrats are talking INSURRECTION here...
I find that EXTREMELY hilarious... :D
Civil War 2.0 here we come!!! :D
nypoet22
83
No matter how many times you repeat your opinion on fetuses being equal to babies, it will still be a minority opinion, not a fact.
Living organisms, yes. Babies, not so much.
Exactly. Zygotes and embryos are also not babies.
If a zygote, embryo, or fetus is a baby, then the fathers of those "babies" (including the rapists [statutory or otherwise] and including the perpetrators of incest) should by law be required to pay child support back to the date of conception as determined by a physician. If it's a baby from Day 1, then pay for it back to conception. Also, if it's a baby upon fertilization, then life insurance from the date of conception is acceptable just in case the baby dies in the womb. Of course, the baby should get a social security number on the day of conception and become an instant tax deduction. Of course, it also isn't too late to file a tax return or amended return for stimulus for your "baby" back to the date of conception. Anyone who hits you while carrying a zygote, embryo, or fetus should obviously be cited for assault and child abuse and/or child endangerment.
If a zygote is a baby, then it's a citizen of the United States and entitled to be counted in the census. Did the census not ask about your zygote, embryo, or fetus in 2020? Ooops. Better have a redo in 2022. :)
MtnCaddy
100
Once again you are putting words in people's mouths to attract attention.
You shouldn't discount the possibility that he's also likely ignorant regarding the facts of Roe v. Wade.
I do NOT agree that there should be ANY restrictions on abortion whatsoever! For in reality that solves a problem that doesn't exist.
Roe v. Wade definitely already had restrictions; any moron on any comment board across America telling you otherwise is either (a) ignorant or (b) lying and either way presenting a straw man argument(s) as justification for the purely political decision of the SCOTUS.
He's wasting his time. Who cares if he wastes his time?
Just because you believe that women wait until the last minute to get an abortion has nothing to do with the real world.
He's also talking out of both sides of his ass; I would wager without hesitation that he doesn't even realize how he undercuts his own ridiculous arguments.
But despite being shredded on a regular basis you CLEARLY don't care how you look.
If he did, he definitely wouldn't be arguing out of both sides of his ass. :)
MtnCaddy
101
In fact, Supreme Thomas saw fit to write that marriage equality, contraception and interracial marriage rights are next.
Yes, Thomas definitely did put Obergefell (right to same-sex marriage) and Griswold (right to contraception) squarely in his crosshairs; however, he made no mention of Loving (right to interracial marriage). I wonder why that is... no, I actually do not.
Elizabeth Miller
116
No fucking reason at all!
Your sense of entitlement is showing (again).
Next time you feel the need to lecture Speak2 or myself or anyone else for their choice of word usage, please remember the fact that you generally post however you please due to that obvious "perch of privilege" on which you've situated yourself.
Right now, your insensitivity and hypocrisy are shining like klieg lights on the entire forum, and it's not a good look on you. You following up your earlier rant by putting words in the mouths of others is not making it better by any stretch of the imagination... quite the opposite, in fact. Just saying. :)
@kick 137
absolutely right about the limits that already existed under roe. the roe v. wade decision only protected abortions prior to fetal viability. some states went far beyond that point in their legislation, but that's a glaring omission from most debates on the topic. anti-abortion activists seem to think that roe v wade allowed abortion up until birth, when in fact it didn't.
another major area of concern that the states banning abortion are either ignorant of or are willfully disregarding is the impact it will have on women who experience a natural miscarriage.
first off, many of the same procedures and medications used for abortion are the most effective ways of protecting the health of a woman who has lost a pregnancy, so she can try to conceive again. in half the states now miscarriage care will become MUCH harder to obtain, because of those similarities. and on top of the pain it brings already, miscarrying women may even be subject to criminal investigations.
i can imagine no worse fate for someone who wants a child than to miscarry in a state where on top of the grief she already feels she might then be accused of murder.
activists seem to think that roe v wade allowed abortion up until birth, when in fact it didn't.
Yea and Democrats think that more lax gun laws will mean wild west shoot-outs every day in every city..
So there is ignorance all over the place..
That's not the point..
The point is that everything was status quo back when Democrats were of the opinion that abortions should be SAFE LEGAL and RARE...
But then Democrats went overboard and overreached, as Democrats are wont to do..
Democrats wanted to SHOUT OUT their baby killing and CELEBRATE their infanticide...
This overreach caused an equal and opposite reaction..
And Democrats lost..
Why is that so difficult to understand??
Had Democrats as a Party been satisfied with SAFE, LEGAL and RARE, Roe v Wade and Democrat Eugenics v Casey would still be the law of the land..
But Democrats had to push it and push it and Republicans fought back.. And won
You really need to acknowledge this fact. The blame for RvW and DEvC being over-rules lays solely with the Democrat Party.
Democrats pushed for unlimited on-demand baby killing right up to the point of birth..
And normal sane rational Americans pushed back..
And Democrats lost..
"These are the facts of the case. And they are undisputed."
-Captain 'Smilin' Jack Ross, A FEW GOOD MEN
i can imagine no worse fate for someone who wants a child than to miscarry in a state where on top of the grief she already feels she might then be accused of murder.
I can..
A husband and wife who is married for 60 years and they are more in love after 60 years than they were when they first married...
The husband dies under mysterious circumstances and the wife is accused of murdering her beloved..
Should we make murder legal just because of the possibility that someone might be falsely accused??
Ya'all can argue about the unborn baby not being a "real" baby til the cows come home..
But the simple fact is, abortion after 6 weeks kills a beating heart..
That is close enough to murder for any normal sane rational human being...
And all Weigantians agree.. Their SHOULD be restrictions on abortion...
first off, many of the same procedures and medications used for abortion are the most effective ways of protecting the health of a woman who has lost a pregnancy, so she can try to conceive again.
I find it very difficult to believe that drugs and procedures that KILL an unborn baby would be effective in helping that same woman conceive ANOTHER baby at a future date...
I have to call BS on this.. :D
Back in 2016 when Merrick Garland was having his nomination ignored, i felt dubious about president Obama's unwillingness to stretch his executive powers and call Congress into special session until either the nominee got a hearing or a law was passed to codify a rule on election year appointments. Mitch McConnell abused his power, and that abuse went unanswered by a response in kind.
Not factually accurate..
McConnell simply followed precedent...
Historically speaking, throughout American history, when their party controls the Senate, presidents get to fill Supreme Court vacancies at any time — even in a presidential election year, even in a lame-duck session after the election, even after defeat.
Historically speaking, when the opposite party controls the Senate, the Senate can, at it's own discretion, block Supreme Court nominees sent up in a presidential election year, and hold the seat open for the winner.
Both of those precedents are settled by experience as old as the republic.
The power to ADVISE & CONSENT is the power to WITHHOLD said advice and consent..
Democrats can do the same thing if they hold the Senate and there is a GOP POTUS...
It's a political gambit no different than a multitude of other political gambits that have been and will be done...
The ONLY reason ya'all call it a dirty trick is because Democrats were on the losing end of the gambit.. If the roles had been reversed and it was a GOP POTUS and a Democrat Senate, ya'all would have called it what it really is..
A brilliant political maneuver..
You are on record as stating that there is nothing untoward or inherently wrong with gaming the system to one's benefit as long as one stays within the confines of the law...
The McConnell Maneuver was simply McConnell gaming the system to the advantage of the GOP.. All within the letter of the law...
And so it goes... and so it goes...
Supreme Court Still Has Big Rulings to Make After Overturning Roe v. Wade
Significant opinions are due on environmental regulation, church and state, immigration and other matters
Looks like the show's not over yet, people.. :D
One has to wonder how much more awesome it can get, eh?? :D
Odumbo didn't know how right he was when he said so condescendingly....
"Elections have consequences"
eh? :D
One has to wonder how long it will take for Democrats to start marketing BABY KILLING VACAYs, eh? :eyeroll:
there’s no merit in the Trumpism-without-Trump argument—his administration was a complete failure in every policy area
-Peggy Noonan
And yet, we now live in a world where Roe v Wade and Democrat Eugenics v Casey are thrown on the trash heap of history where it belongs..
We live in a world where the 2nd Amendment is stronger than ever..
And we live in this world thanx to President Trump and his administration..
Calling President Trump's administration a "complete failure" is simply hysterical emotionalism and a total detachment from the facts and from reality...
Look at the bright side here, people..
In half the states, Democrats will be able to have unfettered abortion...
Democrats will be able to enshrine CASEY ANTHONY laws and allow abortions right up to the second before birth..
Just like Democrats wanted..
Ya'all should be CELEBRATING...
Democrats can now create their baby killing Utopias within the confines of Democrat run states..
California will likely become the baby killing capitol of the United States..
So... What's the beef here???
That Democrats can't force THEIR beliefs on states and peoples that don't share those beliefs..
Is THAT really what ya'all are pissed about???
Kick!!!
Good ta see ya back!! :D You have been sorely missed in this discussion..
I completely agree with your argument.. A clump of cells is not a baby..
Right up to the point that said clump of cells develop a heartbeat which is usually around 6 weeks..
So, that would be a natural cut-off to allow abortions.. Up until a heartbeat, it's NOT a baby...
And if Democrats would have been happy with SAFE, LEGAL and RARE, Democrats would not be in the mess they are now..
So, really Democrats only have themselves to blame..
He's wasting his time. Who cares if he wastes his time?
Apparently you and MC do because ya can't help talking about me.. :D
Always good to hear from ya, Kick.. Glad yer back.. :D
One thing that needs to be made perfectly clear..
The SCOTUS has not made abortion illegal... No way, no how...
Anyone who claims that the SCOTUS just made abortion illegal is either ignorant or lying to further an Anti America agenda..
All the SCOTUS did was, correctly, take the courts out of the equation and put the question of abortion BACK where it belongs.. With the people..
Yunno... DEMOCRACY???
Do ya'all have a problem with DEMOCRACY???
And, as far as the fear mongering about the SCOTUS making gay marriage illegal and contraception illegal??
Again.. 1000% complete and utter BS..
If that comes to pass, ALL the SCOTUS will be doing to to put those questions to THE PEOPLE..
Again... DEMOCRACY...
From ya'all's reactions I am beginning to wonder why ya'all hate Democracy so much??
Why you are insistent on imposing Democrat ideology on people who don't WANT Democrat ideology..
That's called a dictatorship...
Why are ya'all so in favor of a dictatorship??
All the opportunities to condemn Democrat violence...
Attacks on government buildings.. Hostage takings.. Attempted assassination.. Arson.. Attempted murder of police officers??
And Democrats and Weigantians???
{{{ccchhhiiiirrrrppppp}}}{{ccchhiiirrrrpppp}}
No podium pounding denunciations of these violent acts...
No House Committees formed to investigate how these vile and vicious acts of political violence were planned and executed.....
Hypocrisy.. It's not a bug in Democrat programming.. It's a feature..
As far as this influencing the mid-terms...
Anyone wanna take a stab at how exactly this works??
I mean, any Democrat that is pro-baby killing already are hysterically anti-Right...
Baby killing (or lack thereof) is not going to inflame Independents and NPAs... We are more concerned with the economy and inflation and such... Yunnno.. REAL issues with REAL impact..
"Look, the girl was already hysterical.. She thought she was going to die.. So she was screaming.. She saw the circuitry in your arm and so she screamed some more.. Big deal.. Get over it.."
-Dr Rudy Wells, CYBORG by Martin Caidin
That's how it is with Democrats..
They were hysterically anti-America before the ruling.. They're hysterically anti-America AFTER the ruling..
Big deal.. Get over it... :^/
I find it very difficult to believe that drugs and procedures that KILL an unborn baby would be effective in helping that same woman conceive ANOTHER baby at a future date...
believe what you like, it's the fact. Misoprostol and Mifepristone, taken together, cause the uterus to contract and rid itself of whatever's inside, clearing the path for whatever comes next. same with surgical alternatives. that result is the same regardless of whether whatever's being expelled is a living organism or the leftovers from a miscarriage.
JL
or for those who are partial to anecdotes, here's a relevant story from 2019:
https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2019/01/10/666957368/a-drug-that-eases-miscarriages-is-difficult-for-women-to-get
RISKS of Misoprostol and Mifepristone..
INFECTIONS
One of the risks of the abortion pill occurs in some cases when the abortion pill is unsuccessful at completing the abortion procedure, resulting in retained fetal tissue in the uterus. If left unnoticed, this retained tissue can lead to dangerous and potentially life-threatening infections.
Such infections can produce uterine scarring that will cause infertility..
Further, Misoprostol and Mifepristone is not safe to use after 10 weeks..
But isn't it all a moot point??
Democrats will still have abortion sanctuary states...
And everyone knows that Democrats don't give a rip about women in Red states anyways..
So, the only beef I can see here is that Democrats are bummed they can't impose their ideology on those who don't agree with their ideology..
Tuff doo doo....
For those that claim Stare Decisis is sacrosanct....
Why Democrats Oppose Emancipation For The Unborn
The Supreme Court’s decision in Roe was as shameful as its decision in Dred Scott — and for the same reason.
Pro abortion Democrats today are no different than the Pro slavery Democrats of the 19th century...
They wanted to maintain the status quo of the day for the "harmony of society"... :eyeroll:
Which is as it should be...
Again, the core of the SCOTUS decision is DEMOCRACY...
Call it whatever you will.. Abortion or baby killing..
It's a MORAL decision that the courts are ill equipped to handle..
It should be left to the PEOPLE to decide..
Which is exactly what the SCOTUS made happen..
Three cheers for the SCOTUS!! :D
Once again.. Proof positive that the Democrat Party has not fallen far from it's Slave Owner roots... :^/
Further, Misoprostol and Mifepristone is not safe to use after 10 weeks..
ANY medical or surgical intervention carries risks, any of which is why it's so dangerous to make these things harder to do through a doctor. The best way to make miscarriage care safe is to allow doctors to treat it without government interference.
The best way to make miscarriage care safe is to allow doctors to treat it without government interference.
Doctors are already allowed to perform miscarriage care...
But if a woman used those drugs at home without a local doctor involved and it was after 6 weeks, then it's obvious that she was trying to kill her baby..
You are comparing apples and eskimos...
SUPREMES RULE FOR PRAYER ON FIELD
SCHOOL CAN'T PROHIBIT
Another blow for American freedom and against Democrat Dictatorship.....
Huzzah!!! :D
You are comparing apples and eskimos...
They're baked in the same pie. Hit one and you can't help hitting the other.
Not many apple trees in Alaska.. :D
Not many apple trees in Alaska.. :D
Wow!! Stereo!!! Haven't seen that in a while.. :D
The silence from Democrats is deafening.... :^/
Endless spew...endless repitition...
What a disappointment, but it's nothing more than Don 2.0 and every bit as ineffective. Like you even care, obviously.
Boring.
Endless spew...endless repitition...
Only because ya'all refuse to address the FACTS..
Fact #1.. Abortion has NOT been made illegal by the SCOTUS.. Democrat states are now free to create baby killing sanctuaries where they can have every citizen be a Casey Anthony...
So what's the problem????
Fact #2.. Ya'all claimed that ya'all would condemn political violence regardless of whether it came from the right or the left...
To date, no one has condemned any of the Democrat violence...
Ya don't want repetition?? Then start participating in the discussion..
Don't wanna participate?? Then quit yer whining... :eyeroll:
Boring.
You can change that..
Don't wanna?? Then quit yer whining and just be a lurker...
Historic West Virginia Catholic church burned to ground by arsonist, police say
St. Colman Catholic Church is only the most recent church to face an arson attack
Condemnation???
{{cccchhhiiiirrrrpppp}}{{ccchhhiiirrrrpppp}}
If it was a Democrat Eugenics Center AKA Planned Parenthood, ya'all would be screaming hysterically and condemning the act passionately....
Hypocrisy.. It's not a bug in Democrat programming.. It's a feature
Carp!!
Reposted for clarity... Apologies...
Historic West Virginia Catholic church burned to ground by arsonist, police say
St. Colman Catholic Church is only the most recent church to face an arson attack
Condemnation???
{{cccchhhiiiirrrrpppp}}{{ccchhhiiirrrrpppp}}
If it was a Democrat Eugenics Center AKA Planned Parenthood, ya'all would be screaming hysterically and condemning the act passionately....
Hypocrisy.. It's not a bug in Democrat programming.. It's a feature
but it's nothing more than Don 2.0
Not at all.. You people claimed that you would condemn political violence no matter which side of the political spectrum it came from..
I am simply holding ya'all to yer word...
More than 1 million voters switch to GOP in warning for Dems
Doesn't look good for Democrats, eh?? :D
"Captain, have we not heard the chimes at midnight?"
-General Chang, STAR TREK VI THE UNDISCOVERED COUNTRY
Did ya'all notice that Democrats didn't even try to defend the legal position of Roe v Wade and Democrat Eugenics v Casey???
Democrats only played to hysterical emotionalism in defending RvW and DEvC....
Democrats KNOW that RvW and DEvC doesn't have ANY basis in fact or law...
Democrats sole argument is an emotional argument with no sound basis in fact or law...
Interesting to note that...
nypoet22
140
absolutely right about the limits that already existed under roe. the roe v. wade decision only protected abortions prior to fetal viability.
Absolutely correct, which used to be around 28 weeks when Roe was originally decided but due to modern advances in technology is actually considered around 22 weeks today. The Dobbs case brought by Mississippi originally sought to set the standard of that state to 15 weeks, which Chief Justice Roberts was willing to grant the remedy they'd sought... so now the regurgitating misinformed righties on chat boards and forums all over America are pissing all over Roberts for doing exactly what Courts do every day... either grant in whole or in part the remedy sought by the petitioner, deny it, or issue a decision with instructions that remands it back to the lower court for further consideration, etc.
Imagine your neighbor going to court and suing you for infringing on his property. He petitions the court to have your fence moved 15 feet, and the Court decides in his favor and grants him 100 feet (a remedy which he hadn't sought) which requires the bulldozing of your residence. That's akin to what this activist SCOTUS has done. That's why it was a 5-4 decision; Roberts granted Mississippi the remedy they'd sought because that's what Courts do all across America every day.
some states went far beyond that point in their legislation, but that's a glaring omission from most debates on the topic.
Righties are generally uneducated regurgitators and therefore lousy debaters who present straw man arguments and false equivalencies... ad nauseum. It's a waste of time, and I'm quite sure they don't understand how stupid they appear arguing out of both sides of their ass.
Not relevant to the discussion but relevant to the ignorance regarding facts of Righties in general, I saw some interesting footage where reporters were interviewing Righties attending a Trump rally. They were informing Righties of indisputable facts regarding the 2020 election. As a reminder:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMXMaHtr218
Bill Barr and many multiple others from the Trump campaign had testified under oath that they told Donald Trump repeatedly that investigations had been performed and that there was no evidence of any widespread fraud that would have changed the outcome of the 2020 election and that Ivanka Trump testified under oath that she believed her father had lost the election. The Righties didn't know these facts, and one of them stated something along the lines of, "Then Ivanka ain't no Trump no more." As if. :)
That's why it was a 5-4 decision; Roberts granted Mississippi the remedy they'd sought because that's what Courts do all across America every day.
Not factually accurate..
Mississippi refiled with the court to change the remedy they sought..
Initially Mississippi filed with the SCOTUS to approve the 15 weeks issue..
Then, realizing the opportunity that was available, Mississippi re-filed with the SCOTUS to overturn Roe v Wade and Democrat Eugenics v Casey in full...
some states went far beyond that point in their legislation, but that's a glaring omission from most debates on the topic.
And Democrats went far beyond Roe V Wade and Democrat Eugenics v Casey to fight for baby killing right up to the point of birth.. Unrestricted baby killing on demand...
Both sides overreached, but only the Right side won..
K sara sara... Sometimes you get the bear.. Sometimes the bear bones you...
Democrats got boned...
End of story...
Bet Democrats wish they had stuck with SAFE, LEGAL and RARE, eh?? :D
nypoet22
141
another major area of concern that the states banning abortion are either ignorant of or are willfully disregarding is the impact it will have on women who experience a natural miscarriage.
Willful disregard of facts seems to be the default setting of ignorant Righties, which I refer to as "stuck on stupid."
first off, many of the same procedures and medications used for abortion are the most effective ways of protecting the health of a woman who has lost a pregnancy, so she can try to conceive again.
Exactly. How refreshing to hear from someone who knows exactly what they're talking about.
in half the states now miscarriage care will become MUCH harder to obtain, because of those similarities.
It's already happened in Texas. Women who are early in their pregnancy but their fetal membrane has broken and their pregnancy is over. The fetal membrane can only spontaneously heal for small punctures and cannot otherwise recover. OG/GYNs in Texas are having to send their patients to other states to save their lives.
and on top of the pain it brings already, miscarrying women may even be subject to criminal investigations.
Also already happening here in Texas. Anyone on the planet can make a claim against you. Fortunately, District Attorneys across Texas have said they will not criminally prosecute these cases... not unlike the way they generally don't prosecute rape cases in Texas.
i can imagine no worse fate for someone who wants a child than to miscarry in a state where on top of the grief she already feels she might then be accused of murder.
I can actually imagine a worse fate, but then I've been trained to inflict torture... but yeah, that's a tough one.
While Roe v Wade and Democrat Eugenics v Casey being thrown on the trash heap of history where it belongs is the big deal......
The Greatest Living American Issues His Career-Defining Court Opinion
Justice Thomas' opinion on Bruen is a big win for Americans...
The article is a very good read for anyone interested in the OTHER big SCOTUS case.. :D
Michale
146
One has to wonder how long it will take for Democrats to start marketing BABY KILLING VACAYs, eh? :eyeroll:
No one has to wonder how long you'll spew the ignorant false equivalency bullshit.
Also, if you actually believe a Republican wouldn't do something along these lines if it benefitted his bottom line then no one has to wonder the level of your ignorance... since you're spelling it out in no uncertain terms.
Keep rolling your eyes; maybe you'll find a brain back there. :)
[pick a number]
Only because ya'all refuse to address the FACTS..
Oooo! FACTS are in all caps so either you're "shouting" or your so-called "facts" are doubly specially true!
Anyways...GotEntitlement?
I missed the part about where anyone in Weigantia is entitled to a reply.
Awww Kick..
I thought you had outgrown such silly and childish personal attacks...
Apparently not..
Oh well... I can't say I am surprised..
[180]
Yep, I've missed ya Kick.:D
I missed the part about where anyone in Weigantia is entitled to a reply.
It's not a question of entitlement.. It's a question of ya'all standing by ya'all's word..
You try and hold me to my words, yet ya refuse to hold your word...
So, that makes you no better than you claim I am.. :D
See how that works?? :D
Irregardless, the simple fact is, Democrats (and Weigantians apparently) LOVE political violence... As long as it's Democrats committing the violence against the RIGHT people...
It's fine.. It's not as if I am actually surprised by the lack of condemnation for this Democrat political violence..
I always knew it...
But I appreciate the name-check.. :D
It's always nice to see that ya care.. :D
Over 100 Georgia sheriffs condemn Stacey Abrams over 'defund the police' foundation ties
The Seattle-based Marguerite Casey Foundation has repeatedly called for defunding the police
Stacey BIG LIE Abrams doesn't stand a chance of being elected GA Governor...
Another failure of Biden's Handlers and Democrats.. :eyeroll:
Democrats simply have NOTHING to run on in November... Nothing but failure after failure after failure...
Michale
148
In half the states, Democrats will be able to have unfettered abortion...
Incorrect. Forty-three states prohibit abortions after a specified point in pregnancy, with some exceptions provided, generally when an abortion is necessary to protect the patient's life or health.
Ya'all should be CELEBRATING...
You should be cracking a book; your repetitive prattling is incorrect.
Democrats can now create their baby killing Utopias within the confines of Democrat run states..
Incorrect again. There is nothing in Dobbs that has now granted this.
California will likely become the baby killing capitol of the United States..
Ronald Reagan... not a Democrat.
So... What's the beef here???
That Democrats can't force THEIR beliefs on states and peoples that don't share those beliefs..
You'd actually have a valid point if Roe v. Wade forced a woman to have an abortion, but it didn't... so you don't. You'd also have a point if Roe v. Wade was decided by a majority of Democrat-appointed judges, but it wasn't and far from it.
It was majority Republican-nominated justices of the SCOTUS who decided Roe in 1973 with a 7-2 vote that was not along partisan lines:
Harry Blackmun (R) appointed by Nixon wrote the Roe opinion
William Brennan (R) appointed by Eisenhower
Potter Stewart (R) Eisenhower
Warren Burger (R) Nixon
Lewis Powell (R) Nixon
William Douglas (D) FDR
Thurgood Marshall (D) LBJ
Those who dissented:
Byron White (D) Kennedy
William Rehnquist (R) Nixon
A lifelong Republican SCOTUS justice wrote the majority decision in Roe. Five Republican-nominated justices and two Democratic-nominated justices ruled for choice with limitations... not for forced abortion.
Republicans wanted (past tense) less government interference and less government regulation in people's lives, medical decisions, and personal lives.
When the religious right aligned itself with the Republican Party (it's mentioned in the Bible zero times), it then became a political issue. I mean, anyone who actually believes Donald Trump gives a shit about people's lives wasn't and isn't paying attention.
Is THAT really what ya'all are pissed about???
You enjoy assigning words and emotions to others. You're wasting your time.
Incorrect again. There is nothing in Dobbs that has now granted this.
Not factually accurate.. The SCOTUS ruling returns the question of baby killing to the states..
Democrat states can create whatever baby killing law they wish to...
}}}California will likely become the baby killing capitol of the United States..{{{
Ronald Reagan... not a Democrat.
non sequitur....
You enjoy assigning words and emotions to others. You're wasting your time.
And yet.. Here you are.. :D
Always so nice to be name-checked... :D
Thanx, Kick.. :D
Welp, it's that time again.. :D
"It's been a real slice..."
-Meg, HERCULES
But my lovely wife and JOE PICKETT beckons...
So.....
"Hasta lasagna, don't get any on ya..."
-Emilio Estevez, MISSION IMPOSSIBLE
:D
Oh.. And... Welcome back, Kick... So nice to have you again.. :D
Michale
149
Good ta see ya back!! :D You have been sorely missed in this discussion..
I never left. Also, you are mostly responding to your own comments and having a "discussion" with yourself. Heh.
I completely agree with your argument.. A clump of cells is not a baby..
Nowhere in my argument did I say anything about a "clump of cells," and I will thank you in advance for not continuing to project your feelings about zygotes and embryos onto me. But thank you for letting us all know about your "clump of cells" beliefs. If you "completely agree" there's really no need to keep spewing your false equivalency since you've basically just explained your belief about the "clump of cells." Party's over pal, and you just ended it.
Right up to the point that said clump of cells develop a heartbeat which is usually around 6 weeks..
I personally disagree with your "clump of cells" characterization and find it crude and insensitive. Also, thank you for letting us all know you're personally in favor of baby killing.
So, that would be a natural cut-off to allow abortions.. Up until a heartbeat, it's NOT a baby...
We all understood what you meant with your crude usage of the characterization "clump of cells." No need to elaborate further; we all get it, baby killer.
And if Democrats would have been happy with SAFE, LEGAL and RARE, Democrats would not be in the mess they are now..
You're arguing out of both sides of your ass again. It's comical to watch.
Apparently you and MC do because ya can't help talking about me.. :D
If talking about someone means you care about them, then you're head over heels in love with Democrats, and there's shit-tons of archived evidence to prove it. The evidence clearly shows you care about Barack Obama the most, but with time I believe your absolute love for Biden (either Joe or Hunter) will eclipse your archived love for Barack Hussein Obama.
I seriously don't care if you waste your time regurgitating right-wing propaganda and demonstrating your level of gullibility and absolute disregard for facts, and I doubt if anyone else cares either. Sometimes I'll read and respond with actual facts. Most of the time I'll skip the repetitive ad nauseum prattling. :)
Michale,
If this is really true:
But the cop in me sees the inherent danger in NOT having a permit system in place... To allow permit-less carry is fraught with dangers...
Just ask him to pull out slowly and tell him that he isn’t there to talk politics! Then hop out of that sling and go home.
Michale
155
As explained in Roe, the complications from pregnancy are greater than those of abortion and vary from person to person depending on their medical condition and physical fitness or lack thereof. If you're really concerned about life, you wouldn't force people of low income to jump through hoops to seek medical care regarding their pregnancies. After all, the effects of pregnancy on a person are medical care issues regardless your personal beliefs regarding abortion... and not unlike seeking medical care for complications arising from the effects of being obese.
Maybe next the SCOTUS will leave it to the states to decide whether or not they wish to allow heart surgery for fat people who've jammed their coronary arteries shut eating and maybe also allow states to outlaw treatment for ARLDs for those who've overindulged in alcohol. Does it not fit their agenda to save lives? Who should mind having to jump through hoops to get heart surgery? That's what they get for eating and drinking themselves into a medical condition, am I right? /sarcasm off
I mean, there's absolutely nothing in the Constitution that gives you the right to seek medical care for not treating your body as a temple, and that is definitely in the Bible. :)
And Democrats went far beyond Roe V Wade and Democrat Eugenics v Casey to fight for baby killing right up to the point of birth.. Unrestricted baby killing on demand...
Where? What court case are you describing here because I have not been able to find it!?!? I have not heard of any cases looking to EXTEND abortion access to women anywhere in this country!
A good way to know if you are defending the wrong side is if doing so requires you to rely on lies to make your point!
And while we are at it, let’s correct this little demonstration of ignorance:
Scientifically speaking, babies are conceived..
“Babies” is not a scientific term, what you are referring to Science would call an “infant”… and those are not considered “alive” until they are borne. Zygotes are conceived. Zygotes grow into a fetus. Fetuses become an infant once they are expelled from the womb.
Kick,
Love ya!
-R
Michale
177
Not factually accurate..
Believe what you wish; it's totally accurate.
Mississippi refiled with the court to change the remedy they sought..
I can't help the ignorance of those who don't understand that it's the job of a higher court to review the decisions of the lower courts. Like I said, Roberts reviewed the remedy they'd sought and granted it... as Courts in America do every day.
Initially Mississippi filed with the SCOTUS to approve the 15 weeks issue..
Obviously. Which was denied by the lower courts. Therefore, the SCOTUS granting them any different relief than they originally sought is a politically activist move.
Then, realizing the opportunity that was available, Mississippi re-filed with the SCOTUS to overturn Roe v Wade and Democrat Eugenics v Casey in full...
The Casey decision was plurality opinion written by three Republicans. You can keep claiming blaming Roe and Casey on Democrats if it's your wish to keep looking like an uninformed bloviating repetitive rube.
And Democrats went far beyond Roe V Wade and Democrat Eugenics v Casey to fight for baby killing right up to the point of birth.. Unrestricted baby killing on demand...
Name the cases.
Both sides overreached, but only the Right side won..
Incorrect. If anyone tells anybody that this is a "win" for what some people in the South refer to as the "poor white trash" (a term I don't generally use), then they're either ignorant or lying to you/themselves or both. Norma McCorvey a.k.a. Jane Roe was a poor white prostitute and definitely fit that description.
Democrats got boned...
You're still arguing out of both sides of your ass so I guess looking stupid is okay with you. :)
Michale
189
The SCOTUS ruling returns the question of baby killing to the states..
So you're insisting the lifelong Republican who wrote the opinion in Roe and the majority on the SCOTUS who decided Roe with only the help of two Democrats murdered millions of babies? I guess that FACT blows to hell all your claims that Democrats killed millions.
How do we know this was nothing more than a political decision? Republicans are blaming Democrats for the deaths under Roe that was authored and decided by five Republicans and two Democrats. Their ignorance knows no bounds. :)
Democrat states can create whatever baby killing law they wish to...
Incorrect.
non sequitur....
Thank you for proving you don't know the meaning of "non sequitur."
And yet.. Here you are.. :D
Me calling you on your prattling repetitive bullshit wherein you put words in others mouths that they never said and assign them feelings that don't exist while you jerk off on your keyboard doesn't change the fact you get your jollies doing it. :)
Always so nice to be name-checked... :D
Responding to your post isn't the equivalent of name checking. I shouldn't have to keep explaining this, but here we are.
Thanx, Kick.. :D
You're welcome. Now that you're been educated about who created Roe, you can blame the Republicans who authored it. :)
ListenWhenYouHear
192
Just ask him to pull out slowly and tell him that he isn’t there to talk politics! Then hop out of that sling and go home.
Zing!
Also, Michale's "Jack Reacher super cop" routine has confused him. Don't you think he should pick a lane, Russ? First he claims he's a cop. Then he claims he never said he was a cop. Now he's back to saying he was a cop.
What he's definitely established beyond any doubt whatsoever is that he's unequivocally a person who lies about himself... stolen valor, it's called. How pathetic is that!?
Love you, Russ! :)
ListenWhenYouHear
195
Love you more.
Infinity! :)
Hey! Doesn't anybody love MC?
:(
For the record my first name is Taras. Named after the national hero of Ukraine, Taras Schevchenko.
You have to give love to get love.
MtnCaddy
200
Hey! Doesn't anybody love MC?
Of course we do. We twins have to stick together; you know that! :)
MtnCaddy
201
For the record my first name is Taras.
And your middle name is the same as the board's biggest liar, and your twin brother's name is Gerard and your Mom's name was Nadia (not to be confused with mafia).
You think we forgot? Nope. :)
i certainly forgot.